This is a project that's been on going since the days of my Lenco experiments. My Lenco project is posted as a virtual system here at Audiogon too.
My Technics SP10 MK2 in custom African Wenge plinth is posted in my main system and this Technics SP10 MK3 in Panzerholz and Ebony Plinth was completed November 20th, 2008.
More images to follow, including the Ebony custom platform it will rest on. The platform is 9 layer construction including a layer of Texas Instruments shield with active ground plane.
You mention that the Garrard done up properly with the Loricraft PS and all costs more than the MK3 ... Would you think it can sound better? Linnmaster
Both are excellent tables, one of the guys in my group has a Garrard with Triplanar and it's one of the finest tables I've ever heard. Whether the Garrard or MK3 is superior is likely in the eyes and ears of the beholder.
The Garrard is probably a bit warmer with a nice pitch to the bass and the Technics more speed accurate and quieter. I have no proof of either comment, just an estimation based on limited listening.
12-11-08: Linnmaster I second or third all the compliments that have been made about your SP10 MK3 plinth that you built. Really does look stunning.
Thank you very much
Do you know which product it actually is out of their range? They do some bulletproof stuff and some other products that are used solely in the music industry. And also, did you had any difficulties in working with the material using typical woodwoorking tools and techniques.
All is know is this is what ExxonMobil uses for drilling platforms. Yes to difficulties with working on it. Even with Carbide tools they had to be sharpened after each pass to maintain quality.
In your MK3 plinth, you have Panzerholz, Basswood, Panzerholz layers. What made you use Basswood rather than say maple or mahogany?
That was a judgement call based on the "feel" and resonance of the different layers.
Another point of interest is the incorporation of sheet aluminium (thickness?) that was used in your MK2 plinth. You've obviously ommitted this out of your MK3 plinth.
Not correct, the MK2 and MK3 both have a thick layer of 6061 aluminum in the construction, the brass rod passes though it.
Your brass rod/cast iron sink is a clever idea. Any reason for the cast iron chosen as opposed to a machined mild steel block?
Cast iron is better at absorbing energy than mild steel. It's cast because the block I choose is about 1 inch thick although it does not appear that way in the photos. It's very dense and heavy.
I think this idea can be used on the Garrard 301 to drain away any vibrations from the bearing spindle that will have come from the motor.
The main source of vibration with the Garrard is the motor and rim drive assembly. I don't think the design I choose to dampen the direct drive motor of a Technics would help a Garrard bearing, it could even transmit energy back in.
I have less experience with the Garrard and no plans to rebuild one. If done properly, including the Loricraft power supply they're more costly than the rare Technics MK3
I second or third all the compliments that have been made about your SP10 MK3 plinth that you built. Really does look stunning.
I wanted to ask you further with regards to the Panzerholz that was used in your plinth. Do you know which product it actually is out of their range? They do some bulletproof stuff and some other products that are used solely in the music industry. And also, did you had any difficulties in working with the material using typical woodwoorking tools and techniques. I've been told earlier this year by Panzerholz that they will send direct to me as there is no distributor here in Melbourne, Victoria. I haven't enquired on price and shipping however, as I'm still some time away from commencing my plinth construction for the 301.
In your MK3 plinth, you have Panzerholz, Basswood, Panzerholz layers. What made you use Basswood rather than say maple or mahogany? It also looks to me that the Basswood layer is solid hardwood, rather than a ply. I know the Panzerholz is a ply product, and it seems typical that a ply material is used for plinths for the 301, SP10, L75, etc ... but would you consider solid hardwood (say 1" thick) layers (all different hardwoods) laminated together with alternating grain direction? The one thing that would concern me with using hardwood compared with a ply is material long term stability - as you know - wood moves.
Another point of interest is the incorporation of sheet aluminium (thickness?) that was used in your MK2 plinth. You've obviously ommitted this out of your MK3 plinth. How did you glue this with the ply? Further to that, what glue did you use to glue the plinth in general? I'm considering using Titebond II, or equivalent, or hide glue (if I can get the hang of it).
Your brass rod/cast iron sink is a clever idea. Any reason for the cast iron chosen as opposed to a machined mild steel block? In contrast, I think this idea can be used on the Garrard 301 to drain away any vibrations from the bearing spindle that will have come from the motor. Although probably not as effective as on the SP10, at least it will provide additional vertical support for my new 301 platter that's of higher mass. I was actually considering a brass plate (say 10mm thick) bolted to the underside of the plinth, which in turn bolts to the bearing thrust plate, thus providing aditional vertical support as well as preventing any lateral movement/deflections.
A very interesting Change in your analog System. I made a similar experience, when I did a listen to a Seiki 5000 with FR Arms in a friend's system, I lost interest in my Kuzma / Airline combo. Some designs from the past can deliver true magic when done right. You did. Happy listening!
congrats on the Mk3, it is a work of art.....and i'm sure it sounds better than it looks. i will await your Mk2-Mk3 comparison conclusion with much anticipation.
I wonder if the SME is as good a match for the Mk3 as you felt it was for the Mk2?
also; hopefully soon you can comment on the Coralstone and the Supreme......
thanks for doing all the work.....you will make my decisions much easier. i know with all the break-in issues it will be some time before there are any solid answers.
First, thanks again for having Steve, Larry and I in your home, so we could experience your wonderful system first hand.
This last Tuesday night we swapped head shells between my two identical SME 312S arms, allowing us to listen half the evening to Air Tight PC-1 and half to the Air Tight Supreme. A nice comparison with both the MK2 and the MK3.
It's too early to carve the results in stone, but our initial impression was the MK3 was quieter, more dynamic and slightly more grounded to the music. It's a subtle upgrade, but one I think will drive me to search for another MK3.
As for SME arm, I love the 312S, but I've not had other arms on the table to compare. I'm sure the Triplanar would be equally good (but different), just as the PC-1 and Dynavector XV1-S are wonderful but different.
At this point I would say the Supreme name is justified. It's much better than the PC-1 and Dynavector and it should be at $9K retail.
The Koetsu Coralstone is on it's way, they shipped to me two days ago via UPS air. I'll probably receive it as I'm packing up my Aesthetix for Eclipse upgrade. Hopefully it will return and be settled soon and I'll have all the tools on hand to make an informed decision.
Actually we sold the basic units to guys in my group for $1800.00 each and they are Panzerholz too. The additional $1400.00 for my MK3 plinth is due to filler panels inside, the Ebony lumber and fine finish work. I have no proof the Ebony sounds better than the basic unit, I just wanted something I could look at every day that would bring a smile to my face.
I can't tell either about the Birch layered plinth and the Panzerholz plinth. I will likely replace my MK2 with another MK3 when funds permit and since they have the same tonearm, I will have two identical rigs except for plinth.
At that time I think the comparison will be close enough to print comments.
congrats on the Mk3, it is a work of art.....and i'm sure it sounds better than it looks. i will await your Mk2-Mk3 comparison conclusion with much anticipation.
i wonder if the SME is as good a match for the Mk3 as you felt it was for the Mk2?
also; hopefully soon you can comment on the Coralstone and the Supreme......
thanks for doing all the work.....you will make my decisions much easier. i know with all the break-in issues it will be some time before there are any solid answers.
well that would explain $3000 cost for the plinth. Thanks for the info. I must admit a bit of disappointment though. For now I will stick with the birch ply plinth. How does the birch ply plinth compare with the panzerholz plinth?
We built a Panzerholz plinth for the Garrard 301 too, a guy in my group owns it and thinks it's wonderful. Of course the iron block will not work with the Garrard, it's designed to draw energy from the bearing well of the Technics direct drive. The Garrard is rim drive.
The Panzerholz came from a project with Exxon Mobil. My art director for Hunter Douglas (the window treatment people) is also the guy who does special projects for Exxon Mobil.
This particular Panzerholz is used in offshore drilling platforms due to it's strength. Exxon decided to have awards made from the material and ordered a pallet of it shipped in from Germany.
When all was done the left over wood was available and we got it. I don't know what we're going to do when the last of it is gone. The cost is about $1100.00 a sheet plus shipping, and it's very heavy.
unbelievable plinth!! a couple of questions. Where did you source the panzerholz from? Also have you listened to the plinth with and with out the cast iron block? I am very curious about the effects of both the panzerholz and the cast iron block. I have a garrard 301 that has been modified with a new platter and bearing. I am now on the quest for a plinth that will effectively deal with the motor vibration.
Any DIY Audiogon members considering a plinth for their Technics, see link below. I shared my images with Rudolf Bruil because his site was a source and inspiration for my project.
Albert thanks for another wonderful contribution to Audiogon - your turntable looks beautiful and I for one am not surprised it sounds good.
I have always read with both fascination and skepticism the widespread trashing of direct drive turntables.
When I first got started in this hobby, I had a Kenwood KD 500 with an SME Series III and a Grado Signature cartridge.
It was wonderful and I found it hard to go to sleep at night because I loved listening to it so much. Later, I also enjoyed a Yamaha PX-2 - another direct drive audiophile cult classic.
The worst turntable I ever had? A Linn Sondek.
I never listened it, it bounced around like an old car that needed a new suspension, and just NEVER sounded right to me, despite tweaking by an authorized dealer, and various arm and cartridge configurations.
Wondering if I too just didn't get it, I have thought over the years about getting a VPI TNT or some other exotic belt drive....but you have inspired me to trust my instincts and get back to these great machines.
11-23-08: Halcro Hi Albert, Beautiful job with the Technics. Are you able to compare for us the differences in sound with the Technics against the Walker?.......and why you think these might be?
This is part of the same thing going on with VPI rim drive, the new interest in Thorens TD 124, Garrard 301, Technics SP10 and EMT tables.
All these designs bring larger, more direct power to the platter and deliver what everyone calls PRaT.
Regardless of what you call it, the sound is more lively, accurate, powerful and notes are sustained regardless of the complexity of the passage.
I think belt drives brought one sound to the audio community and rim and direct drive bring another. It's odd to remember back when I owned a Thorens TD 124 and the model 125 belt drive came out. At that time I thought there was a loss in the connectivity of the music but told myself that I was wrong, too young to know better. Thorens was a master designer Swiss company and could not possible develop a product worse than their previous design.
Now I realize the 125 was in response to AR and other companies that were taking the belt drive path to isolation. Sure, belt drive works but it gives up energy and power in the process.
If I were in charge at Walker audio, I would keep the current system and also offer a direct drive with a platter mass matched to the motor. The present motor controller housing could hold the electronics for the direct drive and people could choose (Like Chris does at Teres).
The companies that offer choices are growing and I think more to come. The suspension of the Walker, air bearing arm and Lloyd's fierce determination make it a stunning product are what make it the huge success it is. If this were not true, no way would I have owned it for a decade.
If both drive systems were offered by Walker, it would only repeat what Andy Payor at Rockport did, that's in my opinion is not an embarrassment.
Hi Albert, Beautiful job with the Technics. Are you able to compare for us the differences in sound with the Technics against the Walker?.......and why you think these might be?
Hello Albert, what a beautiful plinth to go with your MK3. As usual your projects and pioneering interests have again found you entertaining what is possible on the cutting edge of way cool. Thank you for sharing your projects with us and happy listening.
If you don't mind me asking when all was said and done how much did this project cost and who did the work. Unless of course it was you... Best- Gary
Quotes are retail, except for (used) MK3 table, (new) custom plinth and platform.
MK3 $6000.00 Plinth $3200.00. Platform (no photographs up yet) about $1600.00 SME 312S $2600.00 Purist DIN to RCA Proteus $4360. Koetsu Coralstone Platinum $15,000.00 Stillpoints, set of 4 with risers $625.00 Mods to power supply $175.00 Purist Dominus AC cord $1990.00 Hammond USA to Japan Isolation transformer $275.00 Micro Seiki Gunmetal turntable mat $600.00
It's my design, a guy in my audio group who builds one of a kind, high end furniture constructed plinth and platform in his shop and I put it all together.
During this period, about sixteen listeners joined me in the comparison with only one voting for the Walker. Knowing Technics would be my new direction, I searched and bought the MK3, designed a plinth that I hoped would be better than the previous.
The build quality and technical specifications of the MK3 are vastly better than the MK2, but I will take my time comparing before I post an opinion.
Albert- The table is a work of art. I just have to ask the obvious, does it leave the Walker in the dust? And if so by how much. If you don't mind me asking when all was said and done how much did this project cost and who did the work. Unless of course it was you... Best- Gary
albertporter on All Out Assault