You better believe that they do! Great to hear about your latest adventures!

zephyr24069 November 04, 2009 02:02

Zephyr, Nice to hear from you; I see you've got your Focus HD's sitting pretty! I'll bet they sound pretty fantastic as well. :) I was on the new Legacy site only briefly.

I enjoy both the Focus SE and the King. Though they are of differing technologies, I find them equally satisfying. Owning radically different speakers has put salve on an audiophile itch I've had for a very long time. I have been pleased with how good the Pathi sound on both speakers, even though they have such different characteristics.

douglas_schroeder November 03, 2009 23:36

Doug...have you checked out the new Legacy Audio user forum on their website? They've reworked their website and put in a great forum mechanism where I'm sure your feedback and advice to users would be appreciated...

zephyr24069 November 03, 2009 16:57

Mitch, I have not had the Whispers in my room; the pics are of the Helix, the flagship model from Legacy Audio. The Helix is a ton of speaker (felt like a ton moving them down the stairs!) and was a phenomenal speaker to reivew. I could not afford the price of the speakers, three sets of cables, and triple the amplification costs, so they had to be returned. In addition, having an active speaker with triple the needs for cables and amplification would be difficult for use in reviewing, as many manufacturers/distributors would balk at sending out three of the required item (I know, I tried). The Helix would likely sit much of the time rather than be enjoyed. For those reasons I had to pass on it. It certainly was not an issue of sound or desire to own it. If I were an audiophile with the means and the lack of constraints on daily usage, they would never have left the room.

I elected to obtain the Focus SE, as at the time it had better low end than the Whisper. Now, however, at RMAF just days ago, I heard the improved Whisper with upgraded bass drivers. The shallow low end has been extended and now it strikes my ear as a "little Helix", quite formidable.

douglas_schroeder October 11, 2009 14:44

.
Looks like you had Legacy Whispers before. How do the Whispers differ from the Focus?
.

mitch4t October 10, 2009 03:44

Mitch, a very good question, as one might assume they were mounted "normally", but they are not. The mid-surrounds are mounted in the traditional position of the speaker wire leads coming out from the bottom of the speakers and into the receptacles built there for the feed to the surrounds.

Conversely, the rear MGMW's are inverted, because I wanted to mount them closer to the ceiling, and did not want unsightly receptacles in the middle of the wall. Therefore, I flipped the speakers (which of course, has no effect on the sound), and ran the leads from the speakers into receptacles placed near the room's ceiling. Worked beautifully! I'm very happy with the result.

The surround speakers are "hinged" thus allowing them to be swiveled to any position I determine. If I want a more diffused spatial effect, I place them edge on, or directly perpendicular to the wall. If I want a more visceral, solid effect with improved bass/presence I tuck them closer to the wall, which is where I now have them. In addition to allowing for this change in sound quality, the swiveling feature allows for more generous options in placement of the listening chair and HT seating.

The one thing which must be watched if one flips the MGMW is that the "cotter pin" holding them in their bracket is not held fast permanently. If one moves them back and forth, the pin can work loose - remember, this is supposed to be the top pin, held in by gravity. I do not move them much at all, and the pin stays put. If the pin were to fall out from moving about the speaker could potentially fall. I found the pin to stay put well, and I've had them in place for four years with no slippage of the pin. This is simply a "be forewarned" disclaimer. One could certainly put a bit of blue tack or similar on the head of the pin to hold it in place if it slips easily. Or, if one is paranoid, mount the speaker upright.

I did not put much $ into the HT portion of the room, as I listen to music the vast majority of the time; I see a movie in the room about once very six weeks. Some might consider that a waste of the room, however it was built for high end two channel and it's used constantly for that purpose. I am very happy with the MGMW's in their assigned role as surrounds. However, I am also thrilled to have moved to the Kingsound Kings for main panel speakers. They were not displayed terribly well at this year's RMAF; they sound far better when bi-wired and with an upgraded power supply. I am using Kevin Hayes' "Royal Power Supply", as I have dubbed it, from VAC. I used to be partial to the magnetic planar sound, but in the past five years it seems the technology of ESL speakers has improved to the point that my allegiance is shifting.

douglas_schroeder October 08, 2009 18:07

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Are the Magnepan surrounds mounted flush on the wall?
.

mitch4t October 08, 2009 05:47

Dennis, certainly a pleasure to meet you and share the RMAF experience. I'll bet the Dartzeel and Legacy combo sounds great! Each generation of Legacy products keeps getting dramatically better. I heard the very recently updated Whisper speakers, with new bass drivers allowing for extended LF, and I was impressed.

douglas_schroeder October 08, 2009 01:56

Loved your Audio-HT dedicated room. Definately a labor of love and certainly a "big blessing" to have used so many wonderful speakers in your system. Just to let you know that I am currently using a Legacy Focus 20/20 in my system that is powered by a Dartzeel integrated amplifer. Glad to have met you at RMAF. Greetings and Aloha. Dennis (Hawaii).

hawaiikid October 06, 2009 20:54

Forgot to mention, I picked up the Cambridge Audio Azur 840E Preamp and 840W amps as backups, alternative equipment for some rigs.

The Azur amps are strikingly good; I use them in Bi-Amp Mono mode (four channels of 300wpc) going to the King speakers. This is a good way to get excellent results in a more affordable manner trying to purchase speakers and amps. I have been running source (with level control built in!) direct to the amps. This is an extremely potent, clean and affordable way to run the exquisite King ESLs!

It should be noted that from my understanding the Azur amps only take XLR/Balanced cables when in Bi-Amp Mono or Bridged Mono mode. So, having a source with both level control built in and XLR outs is necessary to accomplish this with the Azur amps. The Pathos integrateds do have both XLR and RCA inputs.

douglas_schroeder September 04, 2009 15:30

System edited: A very exciting day for me, as I can show what I've been working on the past several months - the Kingsound King review. A stunning speaker, which has taken up permanent residence in my home (Full review published today on Dagogo.com). I have been running the King with custom power supplies from Kevin Hayes at VAC. I will save the descriptive applause for my article. I also have made a marvelous upgrade to the Legacy Focus, moving to the SE version. This, too, is an outstanding speaker. I'm finding my own particular audio consilience between dynamic and planar speakers. It seems my ear enjoys the openness and speed of the planar Mid/Treble. Now, I have two "flavors" of it, both of which I find tremendously satisfying. The "Guess the speaker," contest is officially over, with no winners. No one takes home the million dollar prize. Pity. ;) The Pathos Classic One integrateds have been upgraded to MkIII version. These continue to be all around strong performers with all manner of gear. They sound equally impressive with the Focus SE or the King.

douglas_schroeder September 01, 2009 16:19

I agree that there is something special about the wall of sound that a high quality planar puts out. I also like to walk behind them in friends' systems over the yeears and still have image definition and relative placement of instruments, etc.....

Thanks Doug, have a great day!

zephyr24069 June 04, 2009 22:59

Zephyr, I was not all that surprised no one guessed the speakers entitled, "No One Guessed"; they are Canary Audio "Zama" speakers. Quite the esoteric model. They had a very unique blend of qualities - nearly full range, yet very high efficiency, with crystal clear mids. However, the mids were a bit restricted in frequency from coming through such a small pair of drivers. Consequently, the speaker did not have as much coherence as most I work with now.

I enjoyed them, but proceeded to sell them to an acquaintance. He adored them, but when he tried to move his equipment rack he made a boo-boo and hooked up the leads wrong (he should have called me to do it). The result was that he blew out the entire left side of his sytem, multi-channel amp, subwoofer, and of course the rare and virtually impossible to repair Zama's. So, they are now defunct. It hurts to see such an unusual and beautiful speaker damaged. :(

The Focus SE's are an excellent speaker; I have been enjoying them thoroughly, and it was an excellent move to switch to them from the HD's. However, due to a scintillating newer Planar arrival (on review; sorry, can't divulge yet) they have been sitting for the moment. Because the SE's use a planar mid and neo-ribbon tweet they sound remarkably similar in mids/highs to the big planar. The key difference is the "wall of sound" much larger soundstage with the planar vs. the point source of the small 4" mid and 1" tweet of the SE. I find both to be capable of very good performance.

What I'm learning is that my conception of great sound in mids and highs leans toward the magnetic planar/ribbon/ESL end, even when working with a dynamic speaker (the Focus SE is a hybrid planar/dynamic). The very enjoyable aspect of this is that the larger planar gives me the expansive soundstage - the classic "wall of sound", while the smaller planar elements of the SE yield the more focused/point source type of sound. Neither sound can be identically replicated by the other. I enjoy both immensely, and I do not care to be without one or the other.

douglas_schroeder June 04, 2009 18:17

Doug...how do you like the Focus SE's? What are those unique speakers titled 'No One Guessed' in the pictures above?

zephyr24069 June 04, 2009 00:57

Vx700, I appreciate the comments. The Whispers went "Bye Bye," back to Legacy Audio, as they are truly a wealthy man's speaker; beyond their cost they require six channels of amplification and three sets of cables. By the time one is finished it's a serious price tag. It's a speaker for those who can truly afford it; I'm very blessed I had several months with it. I have chosen what to give in offerings/charitable giving and what to spend on equipment, and that will not change no matter what equipment comes through the door. The Helix was a tough one to give up. It is the first piece of gear I really wanted which I had to say "no" to. If I bent my spending rules to acquire them I could have. However, I would have been spending far more on myself than I feel I should (I feel I would have been stealing from contributing to the family's needs/desires). It would have meant a great imbalance in the quality of equipment in the rig as well and would have taken me years to equalize it. In addition, once I worked through the logical multi-channel amps, if I would not have been able to secure triple amps and sets of cables for review it would have meant the speakers likely would sit idle for long stretches as they wouldn't be able to be a reference speaker for said review equipment. Finally, it would have left me no maneuvering for potential ownership of other amps/cables/sources, etc. So, as weird as it sounds, being a reviewer actually added complications to the decision. It all added up to a reluctant farewell. If I were merely an audiophile who had the means you can bet, after such an audition, I would own them now.

Maybe some unknown rich uncle will die, leaving me enough to buy the Helix. ;)

Don't worry, I didn't leave myself in too poor of shape. My consolation is found in the amazing Focus SE, which is no slouch; it has not failed to impress me regardless of what electronics I put on them. I wrote a short update to the Focus HD review on Dagogo.com, where I comment on the Focus SE version. I'm not sure when it will appear but you can watch for it.

I've got the gaming thing going with the X-Box in the HT. I may go to the PS3 soon, as it incorporates Blu Ray. (My sons are wearing out the PS2 in the family room). Yes, Halo etc. on 100" screen is a "Blast"!

douglas_schroeder March 02, 2009 06:05

Nice project, I am like you with respect to two channel. I have the amps, speakers, pre am etc for 7.1 but I am more two channel. I even went as far as getting a dedicated pre am just for two channel listening.

Do you have a PS3 yet? If not try it in your system if you like gaming what a blast (literally).

But where did the Whisper's go? Nothing wrong at all with the Focus, but the Whispers are just wow!
Nice job thanks for sharing

vx700 March 01, 2009 20:45

System edited: Finished up with the Legacy Audio Helix Review; thought I'd show you what I suffered with for a few months. ;) Though they look way too big, the Helix sounded superb. After their departure I upgraded to the Legacy Focus SE version, seen in profile in the system pic. Pathos and Legacy - a very nice combo! No one guessed the obtusely shaped speakers; Canary Audio Zama's. Beautiful esoteric speakers!

douglas_schroeder February 26, 2009 06:11

I feel the Focus HD is very competent top to bottom. Especially with use of amps in the 500-1,000wpc range the bass is taut and extremely powerful. I can see where with some amps 50wpc or less, or Mid-Fi-ish surround receivers, or low power SET amps they might be considered less precise in the bass. But with proper power and a good source they are refined and clean in the low end.

Regarding the walls, they are a bit darker than a neutral shade of cream/beige. We did them with a faux finish over the slight knock down effect on the walls. It was a perfect choice; they look very rich and inviting. I didn't want an extremely dark look, just enough to not reflect much off the screen when using the projector.

douglas_schroeder December 03, 2008 22:39

Doug,

Looks great you obviously get to see some awesome gear. I always had a soft spot for the Focus speakers. Are they worth it in all respects other than the bass? I like the walls also because there are too many all neutral rooms.

mjorgensen December 01, 2008 00:42

Kiwi, it's looking like it will be closer to mid-year. I have been very deep into it with some high end gear for upcoming reviews. Once that is all taken care of, then it's on to the amps in question. Patience is a virtue. :)

douglas_schroeder November 27, 2008 01:44

Kiwi, I don't want to lead you on in terms of the timing of the review. The amps just came in so it will be a while until the review appears, likely next year.

How is your review going Doug? Is it still targeted for publication early next year? Keenly await your update.

kiwi_1282001 November 25, 2008 16:23

Loc, There may be some improvement with the XLR, however the cables used will have almost as much influence. Changing the power cord will have almost as much influence. So, it's not a major problem if you use the RCA inputs on the Pathos.

Power Cords are very much like mixing your own drink - to taste. I have no experience with the PS Audio cables so I can't help there. If the PS Audio cables are inexpensive and you end up getting a second Pathos amp, then swapping them would likely make a big difference. I have done Tara Labs, MIT and Wire World reviews; you can read them for an idea of what might be a sound you are after and then try it.

douglas_schroeder November 19, 2008 22:04

Thanks Douglas. Do you think using the XLR outputs on the Pathos will improve the sound? The Saturn doesn't have XLR. I am using PS Audio plus PC for both Saturn and Pathos. Do you think I should upgrade the PC?
Thanks.
Loc

lamcam November 19, 2008 16:54

Lamcam, I felt the sound of the Saturn was very good, except that I had several units with operational problems. I sold my Saturn because of it. I next reviewed the 840C and was very impressed by the sound and flexibility of the unit. I paired it with the Sonos Digital Music System, the review of which was posted to Dagogo.com this month.

I bought two of the Azur 840c units; one for the listening room and one for the office. Both are running with Sonos.
One 840C developed problems with the digital output, so it went back to Cambrdidge and was just returned two days ago. The issue was that the unit would not lock onto the digital signal from another cdp digital output. It also had defective digital output from its own DAC.

I will monitor the unit ongoing to see if it's resolved.

As for potential upgrades, If your Saturn performs flawlessly, I would urge you to consider adding a second Pathos Classic One MkII and run them Mono! It's among the most potent upgrades I have ever come across for the money. The result is stunning. It still is among the best amplification schemes I have ever come across. You would likely not be disappointed to go that route.

Make sure you put a good aftermarket power cord on them!

douglas_schroeder November 19, 2008 16:28

what do you think of the 840c with Saturn? I have the Pathos MkII with Saturn. thanks.

lamcam November 19, 2008 00:29