Hello visitor and welcome to my virtual stereo system!
I am 39 year old physicist leaving in Amsterdam the Netherlands with a wonderful and understanding wife, a 5.5 years old daughter and a cat. I listen music all day every day (iTunes+Shure SE535 at work and KOSH at home). Currently, my favourite musicians are Patricia Barber and Loreena Mckennitt, but I enjoy any genre as long as it is good music (from jazz and classical to pop, rock, and metal). My other hobby is drumming, though I do not play as much as I used to (i.e. 30-60 minutes per week).
Regarding my Hi-Fi believes, I am very found of Accuphase electronics, a firm believer in subwoofers, and do not believe all the hype about cables. With speakers it is more difficult! I was in a long term relationship with the Focal Utopia Micro Be & REL Stentor combo, then I was briefly in love with the Dynaudio C1 monitors. I have fantasised about Avantgarde speakers for a very long time, and till recently I did not find a dealer that was willing to let me audition them in my system. Currently, I own the Avantgarde Uno speakers, but as one would expect, now I have other fantasies, e.g. Avantgarde Trio, TAD CR-1 & Evolution E1, Marting Logan Summit X...
Finally, in case you wonder, I have named the system after ambassador Kosh Naranek (the vorlon in the Babylon 5 series) - a "metaphor" for the elusiveness, beauty and frustrations found in this hobby.
Thanks for stopping by and do not be shy, let me know your honest opinion about my system and hi-fi believes.
Yes i buyed Dyn Focus 380 Gryphon diablo amp Crystal cables ultra and kuzma ref. mk2 tt with 4point arm...i got diablo, better amp at even better price than emitter1 so it was no brainer for me...im enjoying my system very much listening all sorts of music on it without a fuss...now its all matter of good or bad production...so i agree that rock metal has much of sloppy produced albums(when i think better rock is not exeption...all sorts of music has weak production but rock sounds particulary painful) maybe Dyns wouldnt be first choice for rock either for me but this speaker does every kind of music well and if i was unsatisfied with rock presentation i would not take it but i concluded that all has more to do with cabling and amp then speaker...when i tried cardas cabling sound was colored, slower and softer than real...when i installed crystals...it was like a new world...very non colored, correct speed(some folks like to call these like amps or cables fast but i call them correct speed becuz all other cables and amps i tried was mostly slower than it should be) and natural cables...best ive heard in home audition...so when you told that your c1s sounded broken, slower than avantgardes for me its no doubt a mismatch with amp-cables...you probably did not set up it right...confidence models are better than focus no doubt but on my focus i dont hear even hint of slownes or whatsoever...for example you can download morbid angel heretic album and put song named "drum check"...i turn the volume on very high loud levels...for sure it will test dynamical capabilitys of your system...on my system it goes effortlesly without one tone left out and without hint of distorsion or system breaking...uncanny...its matter of control...so if i put c1 on my system i guess it would sound anything but broken or slow...im sure in that...on a matter of transparency im aware that dyns are not last word but call them they sound like drivers from out of the box...they only sounded like that when i powered them with 40w luxman and karan ka-180mk2 integrated...read...i underpowered them...so i couldn be more satisfied with control of amp...we tried to push avalon isis speakers with diablo...it was pushing them without a breaking a sweat...also very neutral and uncolored as any of my components...regarding avantgardes i guess my friend diddnt set up them right although he tried his best...and about looks of components....its the last thing i look when i buy components....sound is what matters most but i just mention its becuz strange look nothing more...nice to talking to ya pal :)
Hi Raindog031, thanks for the nice words. :) I have actually upgraded my power amp to the A-65 amp. I will need to update the page. How is you system building going? If I remember correctly you were interested in Dynaudio C1s and ASR emitter electronics. Did you buy them already?
Paul first of all tnx on your good response...integration of subs that i wrote has nothing to do with my friends opinion(he only said that timbre of acoustical instruments like double bass sounds more "real" on good floorstanders rather than low and mid priced subs) but with my observation on many friends who diddnt had succesfull integration...some of them gived up and some of them where forced to buy new subs...so i could guess that sub integration aint piece of cake...not that i never heard properly integrated sub...regarding the dynamics i wrote on B-1s i meant when listening one instrument on louder levels its fine but when 2 or 3 instruments start to play suddenly i feel like to turn volume down no matter the music playing...that could be due to the amp or source but i heard through speakers so im tellin what i heard(btw i believe you are satisfied with rock/metal presentation vivids B-1 have but if you like ill list you atleast 10 speakers in similiar or cheaper price range that i heard and in my opinion does it better than vivids)...but K-1s diddnt had that problems(K-1 heard first with dartzeel integrated which sounded very good but did not had bass control and energy like with goldmund integrated...needles to say he changed dartz for goldmund)...regarding avantgarde speakers...same friend who now has K-1(exeptional and natural sounding speakers) had avantgardes...in my(and his) opinion these speakers have bigger than real sound...midrange was fat...voices and images was bigger than real(with several high end integrateds)...afcourse i dont want to bash avantgardes (also after avantgardes vivids looked beautiful:)...maybe it was due sinergy...dont know...but he changed speakers in less than half year...not everyones cup of tea...i also read few times your c1s review...excellent review i must say... i will read your opinion on D1 right now...and to the OP i reccomend one more bookshelf to consider...Gryphon Mojo...after some of contradiction in our views about that speakers i wish that we all listened same speakers in same room(why do i think even then our opinions would differ:)...regards...
here is my reply:
1) I would not advice one to invest too much into a stereo that will mostly play metal (and rock). The reason is that most often the recordings are rather bad. One can rarely talk about sound stage and stereo image on most recording, plus the dynamic variation is practically zero, i.e. they are always loud. (At least this is the case of my 100 or so metal CDs). The most important thing is that the speakers do not have too soft highs, so the guitars sound realistic and not soft and/or over-resolved. IMO Wilson speakers, e.g. Sophia 1/2/3 and Watt pappy 5/6/7/8, are in particular very good with rock and metal music. Consequently, personally I would go for the cheapest 2nd hand Wilson I could find. Other speakers that I have liked with rock and metal are B&W, Vivid and Avantgarde (in no particular order). Note that the Vivids are made to sound good with rock/metal as they are designed by a rocker. IMO, with the right power amp, they are very very good for rock/metal. Half of the time I had them in my room I have listen to metal. On the other hand, Dynaudio speakers, while not bad, will not be my first pick.
2) Avantgarde speakers are notorious for being very hard to set up. It takes patience, dedication and knowledge. They also required amplifiers that can play without distortion even when putting out only a hundredth or a thousandth of a watt (i.e. something that most high power solid stated are not designed and/or required to do). Since by playing with the toe-in of the Avantgardes I can go from much larger than life instruments and voices to pinpoint accuracy in the imaging, I am very sure that your friend did not have them properly set-uped. Regarding their looks, you know the saying "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". I like them very very much, but then I have also liked quite a bit the Vivid Audio Giya G3 speakers. I will therefore conclude that, for sure, we have very different taste when it come to the appearance of the speakers. :)
Percussion instrument (and pretty much everything else) sound(s) much more natural on the UNOs compare to the Micro Be (and also Dynaudio C1). The UNOs are much fast and dynamic, by comparison the Micro Be (and also the Dynaudio C1s) sounded like drivers in a box, i.e. slow and boring.
Hi T0tor0, sorry for the late reply. I did not experiment much with interconnects (or cables in general). When I had the E-550 integrated I have tried two, the supplied Accuphase one and one from van den Hul (Tide I believe). I did not find any significant difference between them. Currently, I use two balance interconnects. One from Audioquest connecting the CD player to the pre-amp, and one Straight Wire Symphony 2 from the preamp to the power amp. This time I did not experiment at all mostly because XLR cables by design get rid of most cable artifacts.
If you will experiment with cables, and find significant differences with your Accuphase components I'll be happy to hear about your experience.
System edited: The Focal Micro Be - Rel Stentor 3 combo has been replaced by a pair of Avantgarde Uno G2 speakers. The move was very unexpected. I made an appointment with a local dealer to listen to a pair of Vivid Audio V1.5 speakers only to find out after the audition that his Avantgarde UNO G2 floor model was on sale. After a two weeks home trial I decided to buy the UNOs. They bettered my old combo in all areas, i.e. resolution, bass, stereo image, sound stage and, of course, dynamic. To top it off, I sold my Focal Micro Be - Rel Stentor 3 combo within two weeks at almost half the price I paid for the UNOs. Pictures will follow soon.
Nice setup with your hifi and drum kit.I too am a drummer and into hifi as well,i have my drums in my listening room too and whenever i get the urge i put some tunes on and let my studio 60s(paradigm v.4)do the work of reproducing the music as i play along to it on my 7 piece yamaha kit.its my favorite room in the house.enjoy!!
Nice setup with your hifi and drum kit.I too am a drummer and into hifi as well,i have my drums in my listening room too and whenever i get the urge i put some tunes on and let my studio 60s(paradigm v.4)do the work of reproducing the music as i play along to it on my 7 piece yamaha kit.its my favorite room in the house.enjoy!!
System edited: Big upgrade on the electronics side: the Accuphase E-550 integrated was replaced by an A-45 power amp and a C-2410 pre-amplfiers, and the DP-500 CD player was replaced by a DP-600 SA-CD player. Sound-wise it is a solid upgrade: a blacker background, a more stable and better defined stereo image, more details and more power. However, I was so sad when I sold my E-550 integrated. I really loved it. Fortunately, I can not afford to also upgrade my speakers (or inform my wife about this plan). It will be another sad moment to see my MicroBes go.
I have always liked Dynaudio speakers, but every time I was buying new speakers I have ended up buying something else (most often because it was cheaper and/or it looked better and sounded almost as good as the Dyns). Unfortunately, I have sold the C1s already. They produce a tremendous amount of bass in my room which at times overpowered it. I am back with my beloved MicroBes.
System edited: I've bought a pair of Dynaudio C1 mk1 speakers. Now the scheme showing the room configuration as it is now is 100% authentic. Real pics will follow soon.
I am glad to hear that eventually everything worked out fine. The set-up procedure can be an exercise in frustration as the Accuphase manual is not very useful. However, when set-up right the unit is a must-have (IMO).
On the same topic, you might be interested in the advise I have received from another audiogon-er who owns the DG-38 unit, i.e. Maxen (see below the link to his system page). He has suggested me to use a much higher value for the "input level" parameter of DG-38. I did not tried this procedure as I was traveling the last two weeks. But i will follow his advise and post me findings.
i tried again yesterday and this time with good results! (finally!!!). yes. like what you described, the imaging is more precise and i also felt the sound stage is deeper. i followed exactly the "Voicing B" instructions and this time, the difference is for the better. Although I did the same thing exactly before, not too sure why it didn't work well previously. The only difference I made was:
1) I pull my speakers just a bit more forward 2) Adjusted the toeing-in to a lesser degree 3) Reduce the tilt of my speakers (Cremona M), by adjusting the spikes
my speakers are rated from 40hz - 30khz. the difference between the L and R channel are not much in this range. Looks like 1 or 2 db max for me. However, from 30hz below, the difference is up to 6db. I am talking about the "After Voicing L-R" Analysis here.
i have yet to get the REL StentorIII. Still considering!!!!
Nice to hear from you. How is your room coming around?
Maybe I should tell you first about my new hybrid acoustic treatments. Because I did not have time to go and look for some decent fabric to cover my DYI acoustic panels, I have ordered some auralex foam in burgundy (panels and LENRD "bass traps") and covered my DIY panels with it. I am extremely happy with the final result. The color of the panel integrates quit well into the room and the speakers, and at the same time make the room look a bit like a professional studio - just enough to let any visitor see that this is a serious music room :). More importantly, however, the end result was very effective from an acoustic point of view. I was able to eliminate at the listening position all echos generated by hand slaps.
Regarding your comment about the distance between me and the speakers, it did not change significantly (if at all ) compared to the previous room layout. It is the new scheme that gives this impression. The speakers are 2.10 meters apart (i.e. 6.89 feet) while the distance between one of my ears and the corresponding tweeter is about the same (maybe 5-10 cm longer). I do not think this distance is that short, but, of course, it is not a lot by any means.
Placing the speakers out into the room, far form any walls to avoid/minimize as much as possible early reflection, is always beneficial as it considerably improves the soundstage and stereo image. Doing this while seating further away from the speakers requires very large rooms, and also lots of power form the amp.
Thanks for the reply. Things have got back to normal here, i.e. the DG-38 is doing again a wonderful job. It was the equalize setting that was screwing up the sound. Once I have set the equalizer curve to flat and then SAVE this change everything went back to normal.
I am sorry to hear you still do not get good results with your unit. When comparing the measurements for the left and right speakers, how large are the differences? In my case they are rather small. Also, how does the frequency spectrum look, any significant ups or downs? The measurements shown now on my system page are not relevant anymore as I have changed the lay out of the room. The speakers fire now perpendicular on the long wall. This gave me a much better bass response. I will upload this week-end some pics with the results of the new measurements I have performed (it seems I am again able to update the system page). Maybe this will give you some reference point.
My previous experience with a Lyngdorf room correction system taught me to not rely completely on the room correction function. That is, before "altering" the sound using the DG-38, I have optimized my set-up as good as possible. Without the DG-38 on I have very good stereo image and bass response. Consequently, DG-38 does very little, but with very significant results. Firstly it clears up the bass notes even further, viz. adding the REL gave me beside more bass a better resolution in the bass notes clearly distinguishing one form another. The DG-38 improves that further. Secondly, the DG-38 also improves significantly the stereo image. Without the DG-38 I can easily localize the position of the singer's head. With the DG-38 I can localized the singer's mouth.
i did played around a few times with the dg-38 but still not improvement.
anyway, it is flat. even after voicing and all. it seems that the voicing protocol (a,b or c) do not adjust the equalizer at all. i tried adjusting them myself though my own understand of the dg-38.
my speakers (cremona m) are rated to 40hz. however, the equalization is all the way down to 20 hz. so perhaps pushing the last octave to flat equalization isn't such a good idea and stresses on the speakers too much. thus creating a muddy sound.
i try to target a flat voicing response as what is rate for my speakers (40hz - 20khz).
for the equalizer, i adjust it so to minimize the L-R speakers difference. Coz only in the equalization can u adjust 2 channels independently.
just my thought but u must be aware i have yet to succeed making the dg-38 sounds really good:(
Somehow I screw up the setting of my DG-38 and I do not seem to get anywhere anymore. (It might have been my toddler daughter who did this. Sometime ago she was briefly in my room and push a few buttons on the DG-38.)
About two weeks ago I have changed slightly the position of my speakers and afterwards run the voicing set up procedure of the DG-38. Immediately, I have noticed a dramatic changed in the sound but not for the good. It was like I was next to a band playing in a bathroom. I could hear all the possible details but it was a bathroom sound
Of course, I've moved everything the way it used to be and run the voicing protocol again but the results were the same. Eventually, I realized that the settings of the equalizer were really screwed up, e.g. +/- 20 dB ups and downs in the midrange region. So, I've reseted the equalizer curve to flat and than run the room correction protocol again. However, with the equalized curve set to flat I can not detect any improvement or degradation of the sound due to the DG-38. It is like the unit is not doing anything. I have also run tests with the "Voicing Only" mode but to no avail.
Can you check the equalization curve on your unit and let me know how it looks? (After loading in the memory of DG-38 the final result of a voicing protocol push the equalizer button. Maybe the muffled sound you get with the DG-38 on is also because of a strange equalization curve ...)
I try to find the time this week to read the Accuphase manual more thoroughly and do some more experiments.
Thanks for the response. I tried voicing B again and it still doesn't seems to work well. I suspect you are hearing a big difference because the DG-38 integrates the REL Stentor3 and your speakers together. However, mine is just a pair of floorstanding so perhaps, there is nothing much to integrate? I will try again when my sub is in and see if it helps in setup.
