This system was made in almost complete isolation and with no other comparables to judge it against, other than distant memories I have of over 20 years ago as to what high end sound is suppose to sound like. I don't have any high end audio stores where I live, nor any people around to go and listen to their systems, so my system represents what "I" think sounds good and not necessarily what "is" suppose to be good. In some ways this is good - I don't know what I'm missing, and in some ways it's bad, I don't know what I'm missing and don't have any direction to follow.
Also of interesting note, is that all of my system has been mail order, and I have been forced to choose from companies with return policies in case the rather expensive (to me) don't measure up to what I was looking for. This, as you might expect, has limited me somewhat. However, I have used Audiogon to great success in garnering knowlege and understanding to pic many of the pieces I currently have. But like most audiphiles I have strayed down a wrong path or two to get here.
As for the sound? Hmmmm. Not sure how to describe it since there is nothing I'm comparing it to, but key thoughts might be "open", "clear" and "presence". The presentation hovers around the speakers and leans to a foward presentaion. Singers are in the room - whick I like. Imaging is great and very three dimensional. Bass is very good with just the Thiels, but the REL sub really fills in the bass below 30 Hz and blends seamlessly to my ears. I wish I could speak with some authority about tone, but all I can say is that it is neutral to my ears, but I really don't know since I've never heard another truly great system as a basis of comparison.
In the end, I can tell you that the system moves me and has let me enjoy music in ways I didn't think was possible. So in that way I judge it as a success.
Nice system Greg. Love the rack! What are some of your favorite carts. Mine are the vintage Audio-Technica ATML 170 OCC and Stanton's CS-100 WOS
which I'm listening to right now as I right this. My seller aligned these carts for me with his Dr. Feickert protractor and they sound so good. NOS old school is all I currently have and listen too. I've got Grace too along with a Denon 107 that's on the way. So many wonderful carts out there.
Again great looking system. Sure it sounds fantastic!
Extremely well done. Something tells me that if you ever go to an audio show you WONT be blown away by many of the systems. I'm sure your well considered set-up would hold its own against many real-world systems.
Out with the old in with the new. So I raided my bank account and just purchased a new VPI prime!
Wow! Just Wow!
To early and too wrapped up in the music now for an in depth review - but I'll get to it eventually. Let just say that EVERYTHING sounds more real and tangible!
Been awhile but just added the PAD pres. revision venustas phono cable and the Phoenix Engineering Eagle PSU and Roadrunner turntable motor control and tachometer. These changes have made the overall presentation more lifelike and natural.
System edited: Ok, the Dynavector P75 MKIII phono pre has moved on, I it's place is comes the Parasound JC3+! I've just hooked it up and started spinning the vinyl. So not broken in. So take these as initial comments: the sound seems very sooth, relaxed but not smeared. Lots of extended detail and great bass. If I'm honest though, the DV P75 wasn't far off from what I'm hearing. Of course I am using a DV cart and was using the DV phono pre's enhanced mode for lo MC carts. But in the end this is definitely an upgrade! Music sounds more musical. Once the unit is fully broken in I'll report back with a better update. I've currently set the unit to 100 ohm loading for those who want to know.
System edited: Thanks for all the complements. So I added a 300 rpm motor to the VPI Scout. I think it was a change for the better. Not night and day difference but a bit more platter stability and tone seemed smoother.
I think you have a beautiful system, and more than average at that. The square lights in back of your speakers are exactly the ones that I have behind mine. I think that I bought them at Target. They make for great ambient lighting.
I really like the M51, I wish I could tell you that I've reviewed many dacs and this one came out the winner, but in truth it is the only dac I ever owned. All the rest of my past digital equipment was middling quality CD players at best - not bad mind you - but compared to what most audiophiles would consider high end surely nothing to boast about.
The M51 is an honest DAC that give seems to give overall great performance.
Im sure if you have a "super rig" with much better quality than what I present I'm sure there might be better contenders out there for you. But for $2k - which btw I consider more than enough to pay for silicon chips housed in a box - I can't say I loose any sleep at night with my choice.
Nice rig. It may be all mail order but looks state of the art to me. How do you like the M51? I have considered that unit in my search for a new dac. BTW all that matters is if it sounds good to you. Congrats!
The sub-woofer I have one REL sub-woofer and it has two options for input, a high capacitance and a low pass. I chose the high capacitance which, on my sub is like 10000 ohms, and it has two positive leads and one negative. They hook directly to the amp binding posts. Essentially combining two channels into one. My understanding is that because of such a high capacitance it doesn't affect the normal output of amp. This connection to the sub is proprietary so I realize that doesn't help you, but it is how I ended up hooking up my sub-woofer. But since you have two subs, what stops you from running a "y" connection off the "pre-outs" on the NAD it would seem you would keep things loaded equally between the two channels.
If your running a balanced outputs to your amps you might be able to run the normal single ended outputs to the subs.
I hope I understand your question. If not feel free to clarify and I'll be happy to get back with you.
Thanks for your contribution to the nad m51 subwoofer connection palaver. I have purchased two subs to connect to my 2 channel rig. Not sure how you connected your amp to the high pass input on ur sub. My emotiva xpa1 monoblocks only have speaker binding posts as outs. What do you suggest?
Gary...there are a number of cartridge alignment accessories that can help you dial in your cartridge more accurately. Here are a few for you to consider and read up on:
I am by no means a vinyl expert, so if you are in the same boat, it may make sense to also just have a local turntable setup expert (either at a local dealer or audio club) come check out your set up. Otherwise, you can try using the tools above and get Michael Fremer's DVDs for turntable set up and see if you can dial in your cartridge alignment just right. just figure on a lot of trial and error until you get there.
I appreciate the thoughts Cmalak. I actually bought the spin cleaner as a starting point and it seems to do a good job, though I can see where a machine that can vacuum would be a benefit. The sound I'm getting now from the vinyl rig is really nice. I need to keep tweaking the tonearm because I can hear a low level grunge on the inner part of the record. I know there is more distortion there, but I'm not sure that should be translating into an audible artifacts or not. I know I need to tweak my azimuth a bit and I'm wondering if there is a better setup rig than the one VPI gives you.
Last lemming...let me first congratulate you on putting together a wonderful system. I understand that you feel like you don't have other benchmarks by which to jusdge your own system but let me say that the following quote from your system description is the best way by which to jusdge your own system:
In the end, I can tell you that the system moves me and has let me enjoy music in ways I didn't think was possible.
And yes by that metric alone, you have achieved success and what this hobby is all about. It's not about who has the largest or most expensive system but rather about putting together whatever combination of gear that fits your budget that allows you to experience an emotional connection with your music in a way that makes you want to delve more into your existing music library and to want to explore new music.
One suggestion as it relates to the pops and clicks with your vinyl is for you to invest in a record cleaning machine (you can spend $500 and get a VPI or Okki Nokki motorized entry level RCM or you can go with a manual but very effective Spin Cleaner for $79). I think you will find that this will reduce substantially (but not altogether eliminate) the pops and clicks you are currently experiencing.
Check out Agon for threads on record cleaning of which there are a gazillion :-)
System edited: I liked the DV P75 that I was borrowing from my friend. So when I saw the MKIII version came out I purchased it. It initially seems a bit smoother and quieter. The manual says the P75 benifits from extended break in time - so we'll see. . .
System edited: Ok, finally added the vinyl component to my rig. I'm new to vinyl and have never really heard any systems with vinyl so my impressions have no reference, so take them with a grain of salt. So far I have about 12 hours of play time on the new Dynavector 20x2 cart, so it's still breaking in. The first hour the cart was quite bright and flat sounding and I was like if this is what vinyl is I'm not impressed. Luckily after about 10 hours or so it really started sound full and much more 3 dimensional, with the timber having a slightly warm feeling to it. As compared to my digital rig there isn't a whole lot of difference so far between them. The digital seems to have a bit more air right now, and maybe, tonally, bet more lean sounding. I am liking the fuller sound of vinyl but I'm not sure it's more accurate. The pops and ticks - not sure there is a real bonus to vinyl with these, but if the TT keeps getting better I can see why some can overlook the fault. Regardless of my impressions now I need to let things settle in and give you my thoughts further down the road.
I think it's only appropriate that I update since acquiring the BAT preamp. This piece has turned out to be really special in my system. It truly has made the system go from a satisfying music reproduction to something that is truly musical. I never really understood what that meant, I think I'm beginning understand the concept more clearly.
I've read from many that to make Thiels really shine you need to blend SS power and tube preamps - and you know they were spot on. The magic that has happened has opened my eyes to music I've heard for years but have not reallheard till now.
I don't want to gush too much, for there are much better systems in this world. Unfortunately I don't have access to them to envy what they can do.
