Vintage (mostly)

by noromance on ElectrostaticDECCAQuad 57tubesBasementGarrott Brothers#garrardCroftGarrard 401Nobsound
Totally prefer record store style bins over library book style.
Phono only with phono amp for 12" on right phono 9"/preamp under table with tube psu in front.
AudioGrail 401 in Jim Campbell PA slate plinth, Precision Audio Components platter, Artisan Fidelity idler, SPH bearing, with Jelco TK850L and Jelco TK-850S
401 with SPH 12"
Sph bearing vs original
Sph bearing and AF idler
AS vs AF idlers
1987 Decca Super Gold with Paratrace and Decapod
Proto Decapod Garrott Brothers
Faster than Super Gold but not as detailed or as musical. Really good cartridge.
Legacy 12" Jelco 750 with Expressimo Audio brass rear stub and counterweight and Ammonite collar.
Phono preamp tube power supply
Phono preamp tube power supply
Phono amp for 12" arm. It's a RS circuit with a "R" power supply. Bulk foil resistors.
Bulk foil resistors and Clarity power supply cap. Switched tube or diode power.
Hand built point to point work is pretty intricate. Difficult to upgrade components.
3 x Nobsound springs on concrete paver
UP-OCC Teflon speaker wire
Stu Remmington EICO HF35 mods. Running Tung Sol 7581a power tubes and Psvane 6SN7 Globe
Stu Remmington EICO HF35 mods.
..fed by 8 gauge directly back to board.
Power distribution box
System 2: 65" 4k TV
System 2: AudioGrail 401 in 5 sheets of 22 layer birch ply with 1/3" solid walnut top. 1/2" solid maple sides. Audiosilente idler. with Jelco 850L
Bought as a back up but use it more than intended.
System 2: Legacy Decca Grey Garrot on Jelco 750L
Decca Gold with line contact stylus
Decca Maroon rebuilt with line contact stylus
Ortofon 78 and VM750SH
System 2: Refurbed 1960s tube amps with solid core silver speaker cables
The glow of 7851A tubes
System 2: View from the 401
System 2: Phono preamp with Telefunkens
System 2: Sub on second rig
US cleaner. Vinyl Stack.

Description

Long story. Started back in the 80s with a Technics SLB2, Rotel RA840 anp and KEF Coda 3 speakers. My first real hi-fi bought with my own money. - fun
Dual 501/AT95 - fun in a splish splashy way
Thorens TD318/Miltec Aurora HOMC- not much fun - dull, rolled off and plodding - what do you expect with a hunk of MDF and leaf springs?
Linn LP12/K9 with Cambridge Audio integrated - better but not great.
Added a Cyrus 2 which was dreadful - brash and dry, sibilant and colored.
Added a Audiolab 8000C/P - no fun - dull and plodding.
Added Monitor Audio 352 speakers - lots of fun - lovely woody sound - captured the emotion in the music.
Swapped the preamp for a first model Croft Micro - utterly transformed. Replaced all resistors with Holcos and doubled up power supply and changed the ECC83s to Telefunkens. Replaced ECC82 with a Brimar CV5042 black plate.
Added a Croft Series 4 Power Amp - better.. until...
I added a Michaelson and Austin TVA1 with MO/GEC KT88s which blew the Series 4 away.
Added a Decca Super Gold - great when it was in the mood but the Ittok combo didn't work.
Added Ortofon X3 Turbo - better but lost something. At least it played without jumping.
Added bronze Quad ESL 57 - removed many veils but creaked and vibrated.
Added Leak Stereo 20 - I rebuilt this lovely but under-powered amp with new caps and Holco resistors.
Added Spendor SP2s - put some veils back up but at least I could listen without torment.
TVA blew up a KT88 - replaced precious MOs with a quad of GE 6550 - better bass, lost the magic midband. 
Also had a Rek-o-kut, Thorens 160, and cream Garrard 301 with a Grace 707.
Packed it all away for 10 years.
Added a $700 Garrard 401 to a $400 birch ply plinth/Jelco 750L arm and the old the Decca that I was going to throw away. - WTH? Amazing sound.
Added new Croft Micro 25 - swapped JJs for the Telefunkens that were in the old Croft - better - and then GE JG5751 black plates - way better. The sound came forward and the soundstage flattened a little but... the timbre/detail/color and blackness improved dramatically and the speakers disappeared.
TVA went dead. It's up on blocks waiting for a late night attempt to fix it... but the HT is dangerous on this beast. If anyone wants it, contact me.
Added rebuilt EICO HF35s - better - wonderful amps - fabulous.
Added black Quad ESL57s - added home-made 20" solid oak stands - no vibrations, no weirdness - just fantastic. Matching serial #s. 
I use $12 Belkin Gold interconnects (preferred to a number of $200-$500 cables) and 12 gauge UP-OCC in Teflon for speaker wire.
Garrard has rock solid stability, image, rhythm, foot tapping, delicacy - bells shimmer, speed - you can see the snares shake on the drum and see the color of the different notes.

UPDATE 10/13 - Got a John Wright Paratrace re-tip and the Decca is transformed. See post below 10/28/2013.

Replaced Croft Micro 25 phono preamp with the R version. While not a huge difference, there is a lower noise floor, better bass, more tonal color and a snapping into focus of the imaging. If you are running these amps with stock JJ tubes, you are not hearing them at their potential.

Update 12/2017 - Added Audio Grail Sable Garrard 401 and Jim Campbell PA slate plinth. Replaced oak table with metal and maple stand. See pics. AudioSilente idler - just do it - best $100 spent. Transformed. 

Update 5/18 - Upgraded Jelco 750 to TK-850L 12inch with Ammonite collar. Essential.

Update 10/18 - Upgraded the aluminum Audiosilente idler to the twice-as-heavy stainless steel Artisan Fidelity idler. Just do it. New heights. You will thank me.

Update 12/21/18 - Replaced platter with Classic Turntable Company 20mm oversized aluminum platter. Excellent improvement to bass - gone is the plummy boom, now tight and colorful. Increased focus all round and better speed stability is noticeable. 6/2021: Replaced platter with newer slightly heavier one fron PAC.

Update 6/19 - Replaced metal rack with 4 concrete blocks. I've never been happy with the metal stand. I had it lying around and it was better than the old oak table. The concrete is a huge improvement in sound quality. Huge soundstage, improved stability of images, tighter and more tuneful bass. 

Update 7/19 - Added JW rebuilt (with extended line contact) Garrott Bros Decca Gold Microscanner

Update 8/19 Added SPH grease bearing to 401 - significant improvement. Blackness, stability and excellent highs.

Update 12/19 Croft 25R. Replaced electrolytic reservoir cap with Clarity TC film cap and phono loading and stopping resistors with Vishay Z foil naked bulk foil resistors. Excellent upgrade. Cleaner, more transparent with voices sounding more human.

Updated 6/2/20 - Added SPH 12" carbon fiber tonearm to collection. Fine sounding. More relaxed and spacious than Jelco 850 but not as dynamic or detailed.

Updated 9/20 - Added Nobsound springs to turntables and amps. See my 'Springs Under Tuntable' post/thread. Improved 3D layering, blackness, speed and transparency.

Updated 9/20 - Added 65" 4K TV.

Updated 3/21 - Modified Croft phono preamp power supply to use tube rectified and regulated vintage Lambda 25 unit. 7851a power tubes. Adds a tube-like dimensionality. 

Updated 10/21 - Added Croft RIAA-RS (single box version from @tomic601) so I can switch between arms without unplugging. Replaced 4 x bulk foil resistors on phono input.

Updated 2/23 - Added Jelco 850L to System 2 401, added Decca Maroon with new line contact tip. Added SPH bearing to 401. Installed springs under speakers and sub.
Read more...

Room Details

Dimensions: 40’ × 25’  X large
Ceiling: 8’

Components Toggle details

    • AudioGrail Garrard 401
    Refurbished Audio Grail Sable Early Twin-spark 401 in 22"x17"x2" Jim Campbell Pennsylvania slate plinth. Precision Audio Components oversize aluminum platter, Artisan Fidelity stainless steel idler, SPH Aluminum/POM grease bearing. Feet are 3 x Nobsound springs on slate pods.
    • Jelco TK-850L 12" tonearm
    12" with Ammonite collar.
    • Jelco TK-850S 9" tonearm
    Added this for second cartridge.
    • SPH Carbon Fiber 12" tonearm
    SPH 12" tonearm
    • Decca London Gold Garrott Brothers "Microscanner" Decapod
    Refurbished by John Wright with line contact stylus.
    • Decca London Super Gold with Paratrace and Decapod
    I almost tossed this away once. Rebuilt twice by John Wright. Added Decapod in 2019
    • Decca Grey Export Garrott Brothers
    Grey Export Garrett Brothers line contact with a side-screw Decapod-like mounting. Checked and cleaned by John Wright.
    • Audio Technica VM750SH
    Bought this to see what a good economy MM sounded like.
    • Croft RIAA-RS
    Single chassis version. Select tubes. Bulk foil phono resistors. Thanks @tomic601
    • Lambda Model 25
    Tube regulated power supply with original PIO caps, RCA 5693 Red driver, Tung sol 7581A power tubes and GZ34 rectifier.
    • Croft Micro 25R
    3x Shuguang Custom 12AX7 LS in phono and buffer stage. 2x Telefunken ECC83 smooth plates in regulator. Vishay naked Z-foil resistors, Clarity TC reservoir cap., BLE Design OFC power cable.
    • EICO HF-35 monoblocs by Stu Remmington
    Rebuilt by Stu Remmington with 3 chokes/PIO caps/triode stage running Shuguang Black Treasure 12AX7LS and new Tung Sol 7581A which are fantastic. Psvane 6SN7 globes are illuminating.
    • Quad ESL 57
    Original pair of black Quad ESL 57. Consecutive #s. I have them on home-made 18" stands. I'm running them with the grills off.
    • System 2 - Garrard 401 birch ply plinth 401
    AudioGrail 401 in 5 sheets of 22 layer birch ply with 1/3" solid walnut top. 1/2" solid maple sides. SPH bearing, Audiosilente idler. 3 Nobsound feet.
    • Jelco TK850L
    On my second 401.
    12" tonearm
    • Decca London Gold
    Renovated Grey Export to Gold. New gold case, overhaul, and new line contact stylus.
    • Decca London Maroon
    New line contact stylus.
    • Ortofon OM-78
    Mono 78 65ųm spherical
    • Croft Acoustics Micro 25
    Telefunken ECC83 and Grant Fidelity Shuguang 12AX7LS.
    • Eico HF-35 monoblocs
    Recapped with 7581A power tubes, Mullard 10M /Bugle-Boy EF86, GE 6SN7.
    • Spendor SP2/2
    Still going strong after over 30 years on my second rig.
    • REL Acoustics S3 MKII SHO
    Impressive sub. Blows away previous Strata 3.
    • Clear Day solid silver Speaker Cables
    System 2
    • Neotech UP-OCC (DIY) Speaker Cables
    24" of 14 gauge cables - monoblocs under each speaker.

Comments 125

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@noromance I  can't believe I've never seen or commented on your system before! Well done I love vintage gear and so jealous of your 401! It's awesome you have the DIY skills to upgrade your gear and especially vintage tube amps. Lovely basement hideaway and I'm sure it sounds amazing!

jond

Great story of your hi-fi journey. Best part is you kept on track for better sound, not just changing from boredom.

mjcmt

Owner
Hey Sub! Great to see your slabs! Your rig looks solid. Great room.

noromance

Hey man - 

A.) Sick rig!
B.) Thanks for the comment you left a while ago about the paper coffee filters acting as shims on my concrete and barn board stereo cabinet set up! I went out and got some patio stones and, weirdly, I think I can hear a difference. It's subtle, but things are a little tighter is the best way I can describe it. Many thanks!!

subterranean6

hi Brian, have you heard from the SPH Bearing man lately? He's supposed to contact me when he's ready to make another batch. Been a long time now, though.

Thanks,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Added Vishay z foil resistors to Croft 25R phono preamp. Wow, what an improvement.  Clearer, faster, blacker, vocalist and instruments more fleshed out and more human. I'd like to replace more.

noromance

Owner
Thanks K4rstar! I may persue moew older vintage tables and arms some day and a Grey Research is on the wishlist as long as it works with my Deccas which it should.

noromance

Great looking system. I am a fan. I know you just got the new Jelco and are unlikely to replace it any time soon. But I would suggest looking into an oil-damped unipivot like a Gray Research clone. I think it would suite your system well.

k4rstar

Owner
Hi Dan, I sent you a PM.

noromance

Hello Noromance,

I searched online regarding the SPH bearing, and can't find any info about where, or how, to buy one. Do you have that information?

Thanks,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Hi Rothwea. It's been one of my big upgrades. It's so cheap to undertake and no biggie if it doesn't work out. Not sure how it would work on a non-concrete floor. Main improvement is a feeling of solidity and stability resulting in better defined notes and blackness.

noromance

No romance, thanks for all the notes about your system changes. It's a great read. I am very interested to read about your experience of changing from a conventional metal rack to concrete blocks. This is a move I am considering and it has been recommended top me by someone else.

rothwea

Owner
@jond Yes, they've settled down somewhat. However, I think if you think they're bright, they don't lose that attribute, the frequency response evens out.
@tzh21y - Thanks!


noromance

great job.  great setup.

tzh21y

@noromance  Interesting you say you find the Psvane 6SN7 bright I had a quad of their Philips reproduction metal base EL34s and found them unacceptably bright. I sold them after just a few weeks. Have those 6SN7's gotten warmer?

jond

Owner
Added a black aluminum 20mm oversized platter to the slate plinth 401. Beautifully made. I did some listening tests before and after swapping out on a number of tracks (after all the tubes were warmed up for an hour.) Definite increase in bass control. I've been having some issues with a little bloom in the low end which have been tamed. Color, speed and focus -especially in the mid bass- is improved by a considerable margin. The sound stage narrowed a little for the first few tracks but seemed to be result of improved focus and increased stability of image placement. An upgrade, at around $750 inc s/h that puts a smile on the face.

noromance

Owner
Swapped out AudioSilente idler wheel (c. $120 shipped) for an Artisan Fidelity idler ($394 shipped). See review in forum.

noromance

Owner
I have been lucky to have obtained over the years a collection of 50s to 70s jazz and blues records. The recordings are wonderful (pre-digital) and full of life. Huge dynamics, see- thru transparency, colorful, detailed, quiet.

noromance

Owner
@jond Thanks for the feedback.  
The Croft is outstanding. I just wish it was tweakable but it is so tightly built, it is very difficult to swap caps etc. An OFC mains cord and Shuguang black 12AX7LS tubes elevated its performance far beyond stock.
I just added Psvane globe 6SN7 to the EICOs. Tremendous increase in detail and transparency. They are a little bright but not run in yet. 

noromance

Was inspired to come take a look from the "What do you like about your system" thread. Great looking system very well balanced, love the Garrard in that slate plinth. I know the Croft by rep is a great preamp and look at that power supply. Love the mods on the Eico too I have Aerovox caps in my amp and they really pushed it over the edge into great musicality. Well done!

jond

Owner
Took the grills off the Quads.

noromance

Owner
Xposted from Analog forum.
Definitely reduces surface noise in my set-up. One thing that has become increasingly apparent is that older analog recordings are simply amazing. Much increased detail throughout the frequency range. I can hear plucked bass strings vibrating against each other where they are innocuous on the lesser arm. Tiny details like the metallic shimmer of a percussion bell are exquisite. For a relatively low-budget level phono rig like mine ($12k), this arm is transformative. If you are in the market for a Jelco 750 or 550, or indeed, a Rega, I implore you; spend the extra and get the 850. It is that good.
The cons:
1. The arm rest clamp is not great. It doesn’t grab the arm like a friction type. It simply rests on it unless you close it and the hard plastic feels cheap.
2. There is a very mild and barely detectable upper bass/lower mid dip in the response more like a slight veiling of that portion of the spectrum. After swapping out the arm stub and counterweight on my 750L for an Expressimo Audio brass substitute, and experiencing the improvement wrought by that, I believe the same rubber stub on the 850 is causing this coloration (note 3). Again, it is minor. I will follow up if EA bring out a brass replacement for the 850. I spoke to Brian there and at this time there is none available.
NOTES
1. It may also be not broken in yet as I only used it for 4 hours.
2. I have not played with VTA - too busy listening to my albums all over again.
3. I also have a standard 750L with which comparisons were made.
5. The arm looks better and bigger in the flesh than in pictures.

noromance

Owner
Xposted from Analog forum. Just received the new Jelco TK850L.
It is a drop in replacement for the previous model 750L. It retails for around $1100 from a few online retailers. However I got it from GEM Dandy's George Merrill who retails it for $895. I used the headshell from the 750. It looks like it’s the same one. I am running a Decca Super Gold with Paratrace stylus on an Audiograil early model 401 with an Audiosilente idler (just buy it) in a slate and maple plinth. Initial impression is that it is a solid improvement on the 750. Listening to Buddy Tate and Walt Davenport in Nice, France 1974. An improvement in soundstaging is immediately obvious as is speed of attack, or rise-time. Depth and width are improved. The music is more colorful. Trombone sounds more golden than I recall while the guy playing tuba sounds like he is huffing and puffing into the instrument. An added realism. Rim shots are faster and snares portray more insight into the rattles -the metal has color and feel...a mechanical quality. Percussion is much improved. Surface noise seems reduced, supressed even. Now playing Jay McShann and Janis Siegel, Ain’t Misbehavin’. Wonderful vocals and very dynamic with jump out of the stage piano fortissimo that I have never heard before. Highs better with oodles of detail but no harshness. More black space between notes... all of that. 
I could go on about the minutiae but I’ll stop. This thing makes music like I’ve never heard. It is a taste of the high end which is lacking in the 750.

noromance

Owner
Fitted AudioSilente idler.
See post.
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/new-idler-for-garrard-401

noromance

Congratulations. A great example of less is more. Removal of coloration and resonances can be more powerful and rewarding than a component upgrade in many instances. The slate plinth looks great.

dover

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