UPDATE (12/23/07): added the MBL 5011 preamp. After living with my Esoteric front end for almost 3 months without a pre, I came to the realization that a pre was definitely needed. Without a pre, the sound was a bit thin and lacking bass. The 5011 addressed these issues and so much more. I did not realize how poor my soundstaging was until I introduced the 5011. This pre does in incredible job of layering the soundstage as well as separating each individual instrument.
UPDATE (12/07/07): added the Ayre MX-R amps. These were broken in by my dealer for 2 weeks before I took delivery. I rarely am taken back by gear but I was startled at how much real these amps sounded to me than my previous amps. There is more detail, more immediacy of notes, very good separation of instruments, and a very nice holographic presentation. I can go on and on but by far these amps are the most realistic sounding I have come across. They are just so enjoyable to listen to!
UPDATE (9/29/07): added Esoteric P-03 transport and D-05 DAC. The D-05 has the latest 32 bit DAC from AKM. Even only after a few hours I hear much better separation between instruments and notes, better sustain and decay, and more authoritative bass. More updates to follow.
UPDATE (8/03/07): added the Oyaide R1 outlet for my amps. Everything is a bit livelier with much better detail. I am hearing so many little nuances I have never heard before!
UPDATE (7/24/07): added the Oyaide SWO-GX Ultimo outlet to my front end. What a difference! The bass now goes lower and there is more detail across the board. I will adding another outlet for my amps next. This is by far one of the best tweaks I have ever done.
UPDATE (7/13/07): I finally got around to adding some heavy silk drapes and they made a world of difference. Everything is much smoother. I will continue to look for ways to judiciously treat my room without making it look like a recording studio.
Beauty:
-The sound is just incredible. Vocals are holographic and textured.
-The MBL 5011 preamp is beautiful to look at. Luckily the sound is just as good.
-The Ayre MX-R amps are just gorgeous to look at. The casework is outstanding. And as my wife said, "they are so cute"!
Beasts:
-The Usher BE-10 speakers are big and thick producing a powerful yet delicate sound.
-The Esoteric P-03 transport is incredibly heavy (75lb) and big but it sure sounds good.
My system has undergone A LOT of changes over the last few years. This has been mainly to me figuring out my own listening preferences and understanding what I wanted to get out of my system. After swapping out a lot of components and spending too much money, I have finally settled down a bit.
I listen to all kinds of music but tend to favor anything with female vocals, particularly acoustic folk and vocal jazz. I also favor simple orchestration and basic instrumentation with a preference for acoustic guitar and piano. The less number of instruments between me and the vocals the better. I mainly go to listen to music in small, intimate venues where I am able to sit within a few feet of the band.
Given my musical tastes, I wanted to put together a system that is able to reproduce the sound as organically as possible. I want to hear every little detail like the quiver in a singer's voice, the sound of the guitar pick striking the string, the feeling of the hammer hitting the piano string. To me, these tiny nuances help to make the music sound as real (i.e. organic) as possible. To this end, I wanted a system that was detailed, dynamic, fast, and immediate with just a hint of warmth. I did not want anything that was too syrupy sounding though. My current system gives me everything I am looking for. It is as close to hearing musicians in my room that I have ever heard with any previous iteration of my system.
I love the Esoteric sound so much I had to get their P-03 transport.
Esoteric D-05
Anniversary model with new AKM 32 bit DAC
Esoteric VRDS-Neo
This transport is a work of art! By far, the best, most accurate transport available. The amount of detail it extracts is amazing!
Sonos ZP-80
Wireless digital music system. Digital output is sent to Esoteric D-05 DAC, a huge improvement over internal DAC. I enjoy my music so much more now that I have instant access to my 40K song library
MBL 5011
A very musical preamp with outstanding soundstaging and separation of each instrument.
Ayre Acoustics MX-R
I am so happy with these amps. They make everything sound so real it is startling! The transparency and dynamics suit my preferences perfectly!
Usher BE-10
Very dynamic and neutral sounding speaker. I am sold on beryllium!
Tara Labs The One
Very transparent and "tight" sounding cable that also offers weight and solidity. These give me all the virtues I admired in my previous speaker cable, the Nordost Blue Heaven while providing what it was missing.
Acoustic Zen Silver Reference II
Used between my source and preamp. Great detail without sounding bright or edgy.
Acoustic Zen Matrix Reference II
Used between my preamp and amp. Very smooth sounding.
Acoustic Zen MC2 XLR
AES/EBU digital cable from Esoteric P-03 transport to D-05 DAC.
Acoustic Zen Silver Byte
Used to synch the word clock from the Esoteric D-05 DAC to the P-03 transport.
Acoustic Zen MC2 RCA
Digital cable from Sonos ZP-80 wireless digital music system to Esoteric D-05 DAC.
Virtual Dynamics Nite 3
Being used to power by MBL 5011 preamp. Like all VD power cables I immediately noticed more dynamics, speed, and authority. The soundstage with the VD power cables are incredible!
Star Sound Technology SP-4 Sistrum Stand
Great amp stand that helped to add smoothness to my system.
Oyaide SWO-GX Ultimo
Double cryo'd outlet with 24K gold plating - used for cdp and preamp
Oyaide R1
Cryo'd ac outlet with Beryllium/copper and palladium plating - used for amps
HiFi Tuning Fuse
I added this "audiophile" fuse to my MBL 5011 preamp. I am not sure it made any difference but it was cheap and lord knows I have spent much more money on things that actually made my system sound worse! My previous preamp, Classe CP-700 did respond positively to these fuses though. I still may try some in my other components.
I recently heard the new Pass INT-150 integrated amplifier and thought it was excellent. It easily drove Dali MS4 and the sound was great. If you are considering an integrated, make sure you don't miss the new Pass. If you have an opportunity to audition it, I think you will love it with the Sonus Faber speakers. It's a great piece.
BTW, Tommy, I made a lot of changes to my system as well. I have no preamp now. I am using a simple approach - Bel Canto DAC3 direct into Pass X250.5 via Cardas Golden Reference XLRs. Sold my B&Ws and got a pair of Dynaudio S5.4. Next on the list is Mac Mini to start setting up a music server front end with Mac Mini as transport into DAC3 via USB cable.
I'm going for some "organicness" tomorrow at Carnegie Hall I'll be listening to a live performance of Mahler's 2nd with Cleveland Orchestra....should be pretty organic.
And in November, my favorite composer, Shostakovich, 5th Symphony with Bergen Philarmonic Orchestra...increadible...you can't let me near the box office....I'll buy the entire season and be broke. LOL
Tommy, if your ears hurt, don't listen to it for a long period of time! You will probably need a preamp(I assume you had not noticed this quality with the REF3 in the mix) so be carefull with listyening to your system at elevated levels or for an extended periods of time.
I had the same problem with the highly modified SMcAudio McCormack DNA-225 amplifier. It just caused major fatigue and my ears were hurting. I think in my case this was because of the hump somewhere in the mid frequencies that this amplifier was producing. With your set up it may be something different. May be the Esoteric's volume control is screwing up the overall balance of the presentation and if you used fixed output via the preamp it would not be noticible at all......check it out....if you didn't ship the REF3 yet. Anyway, be careful with it.
cool. I always thought it would be interesting to try one of the Pass Labs preamps to go with a Pass amp....but for me it's tough to get away from tube pre....got spoiled by tubed preamps in my system for the past 10 years. May be one day I will finally commit to trying a good solid state preamp....who knows....may be sooner than later...
T, what have you decided on the preamp? I noticed you're selling the REF, so what's in the works? Or will you just run the rig using Esoteric built-in volume capabilities?
10-03-07: Joey_v ...But I understand exactly what Tommy was trying to say in his initial statement. I agree.. organic is good.
Joey Joey_v (Threads | Answers)
In his initial statement? Did you really? To me it made no sense. Well, until Tommy clarified what he was trying to say after Ras422 actually "eloquently" said it.
So "organic" to you means small venue, jazz club type of sound? If it is amplified, can it be "organic"?
Examples(forget the Spice Girls for now): A Metallica concert at Giants Stadium, a symphony performed at Carnegie Hall, Patricia Barber performing at Jazz Standard all fall under live music category.
Out of the 3 examples, I would consider an event at Carnegie Hall to be "organic" type of sound, if I'm using this term properly. Metallica and Pat Barber would fall under the amplified live music category. Both performances are great(if you're a fan of the artists). It's just that the Barber show or any other show in a small jazz club would be more "righteous", more "audiophile" sounding than Metallica concert, as far as we're concerned. But I'm not sure term "organic" applies here.
I have fun discussing this though....but don't want to highjack Tommy's system thread. But I think to spice it up a bit more and make it more interesting, this was a cool discussion to have.
T, I guess I didn't make a point.... It does not matter what instrument we are talking about.
My misunderstanding of your post was where you indicated
I have finally figured out that I am after an organic sound, not necessarily live sound because I think live music sounds horrible.
and then you go on saying
By organic I mean the music has to sound like its real, including all of the imperfections and tiny nuances (like being able to hear the guitar pick actually hitting the string or a saxophone reed vibrating).
. These 2 statements are contradicting. You're saying that you don't like live music. What is real to you then? What live music events you've attended that you are comparing to your system? If it does indeed sound better than live performance, I'd love to hear it.....if I'm welcomed after this. :)
Have fun dude. Enjoy the game of trading components.
10-03-07: Tboooe...That being said, I have finally figured out that I am after an organic sound, not necessarily live sound because I think live music sounds horrible. By organic I mean the music has to sound like its real, including all of the imperfections and tiny nuances (like being able to hear the guitar pick actually hitting the string or a saxophone reed vibrating). With this is mind, I tended to favor preamps and amps that a bit of warmth to it, which led me to the Pass amps.
Tommy, this is one very interesting paragraph. For me, live music is the reference in sound. Home system is sound reproduction and every one I heard does not come close to a live performance....well unless you hear some amateurs in a bar doing Karaoke and then compare that to a professional recorded performance of the same music.
With all due respect, allow me to disagree with regards to your assessment above. I appreciate your setting a goal to achieve the sound you like, that's great and I hope you arrive there one day, but you have one sentence that contradicts the next one.
I play saxophone and clarinet and I never heard a reed vibrate. I do feel it, that's what the reed does it vibrates, but I don't hear it.
I hope you don't take my comments the wrong way though.
it's like wearing an Armani suit with Payless shoes LOL
No seriously, when you get a better rack, there will most likely be an improvement in sound as well. I got very nice sonic improvement with my SolidStell rack. Symposium rack should be way better....at least on paper it is.
Tboooe, nice!!!! Finally the new pictures with all the new goodies. Hey are you still using Purist Anniversary Aqueous speaker cables? These are killer amps man! They look great on these stands.
So now finally you can enjoy the music and stop thinking about upgrading....... :)
