I like the WP 8's ability to reproduce whatever the Joules can send their way. Speed, they can handle the Joule's lighting fast attack transients. The wonderful harmonic textures, decays and inner details the Joules reproduce are handled deftly by the WPs. The bass is strong, tight, detailed and textured.
The 3 is less congested providing more inner detail with more extended hi's and bass. It has a VTA micrometer that will help with finer adjustments.
Basis Audio Signature motor
Had original motor upgraded to Signature. The new Signature is quieter with less cogging.
Basis Audio Revolution Belt
"It occurred to A.J. that the belt itself may be playing a role. He measured a range of the belts on hand, selecting the most accurate (consistent thickness), and found that the tighter the tolerances, the lower the speed variation and better the sound. So how to increase tolerance was the question. A.J. embarked on a crusade that eventually led him to design his own process and apparatus which grinds the belt and to an astonishing accuracy of one-ten-thousandths of an inch!"
Basis Audio counterweights
Lighter main weight with two smaller fine tuning weights positioning larger weight as close to pivot point as possible should result in a quicker reaction time.
Walker Audio Ultimate Precision motor controller
With Valid Points and Control Discs and upgraded teflon circuit board. The improvement in the total presentation is impressive, smooth and clear were the first impressions. The bass seemed more pronounced and better defined; the highs were smoother resulting in a .."more natural sound".
Air Tight PC-1
Just a fantastic cartridge!!!! Loaded at 240ohms, VTF @ 2.1grams. "Like most vinylphiles, I've listened to a lot of fine moving-coil cartridges over the years. The Air Tight PC-1, TAS' 2006 Phono Cartridge of the Year award-winner, is, IMO, the best yet in nearly every aspect of phonographic reproduction - the most complete." - Jonathan Valin, 2007 Golden Ear Award Winner, The Absolute Sound Issue 173, August 2007 "In plain English, the PC-1's magnets produce a much stronger magentic field, greatly lowering noise and coloration and greatly increasing resolution in every regard. Details are clearer, timbres are truer, air is more plentiful, dynamics are more lifelike, and stage width, depth, and height are expanded... a leap forward in moving-coil design." - Jonathan Valin, 2007 Golden Ear Award Winner, The Absolute Sound Issue 173, August 2007
Koetsu Urushi Black
Warm with detail.
Koetsu Rosewood
I need to remount this cart and find if my recollections are correct!!
GamuT CD-3
The best player I heard at my pay grade in my system, coupled with the Joule LAP-150 Mkll it produces an enjoyable sound.
Joule Electra LAP 150 MK ll
The top unit is the separate power supply, the bottom is the pre/phono. Me likey!!!! Changed the tubes to: 3 x Amperex 7025 '66 in 5751 sockets 2 x Amperex JAN 7308 '62 in 6DJ8 sockets
Joule Electra VZN-160 Grand Marquis MKV Musicwood
OTL immediacy/speed, wonderful inner detail, dynamic, delicate, attack matched by incredible decay AAAAA+++++ piece of gear!!!! A privilege to own a joy to listen through!!! The amp themselves can be tuned by adjustments to the voltage with the variacs, biasing the 6C33CB's between (25) to (33) and with a dial provided for adjustments of negative feedback creating the sound you prefer. Presently running Amperex Holland 7025's and Amperex Holland 6DJ8's.
Wilson Audio WATT Puppy 8
I've been changing positions and tuning by ear only. I measure at the top outside rear corner of the Puppy for both back and side wall numbers. This allows a fixed point for side and back wall numbers while toe in is adjusted, this corner being the easiest spot on these speakers to permit this for me. My normal listening db level is 72db to 83db so I'm optimizing the placement for this volume range as I think the boundary distances are dependent on the db level. The outside rear corners are now at 39 3/4" to back wall and 23 3/4" to lt side wall and 23" to rt side wall. The celling rises from 9 1/2' at lt wall to 10 1/2' at rt wall. The tweeters are 101" apart and my ears are 120" from the tweeters with a sliver of the inside of the WATT visible. This is the best sound I've had in my room!!!
Purist Proteus Provectus I/C pre > amp
All copper
Purist Proteus Provectus S/C amp>speaker
Copper
Purist Aqueous 20th Anniversary P/C CDP
This is has been moved from the CDP to the LAP-150 Mk ll.
Purist Musaeus P/C pre-amp power supply
Using to the Joule LAP-150 Mk2 power supply. Will try different cords eventually. This pic is when it was connected to CDP.
Purist 20th Anniversary P/C wall to VZN's
To the tube section of the amps
Purist Musaeus P/C 15A to Walker control
Cable upgrade for TT motor controller.
Solid Tech Rack of Silence 4
Quieter and much nicer to look at than my old racks.
Black Diamond Racing The Shelf (2)
Two 21" X 19" X 3/4" shelves one under TT and one under the pre amp give quieter backgrounds with much greater detail "Made entirely of BDRs proprietary Carbon Fiber Composite materials and finished with clear acrylic on both sides for an elegant and understated appearance, the BDR Shelf is massive and extremely non-resonant, absorbing enormous amounts of vibration: a BDR Shelf is only ¾ thick, yet it is 25x less resonant than an 8 thick granite slab and has 4 times the vibration absorbing power of 2 thick MDF!"
Black Diamond Racing The Shelf (2)
Two 19" X 15" X 3/4" shelves one under the Joule LAP-150Mkll's power supply and one under GamuT CDP. "Made entirely of BDRs proprietary Carbon Fiber Composite materials and finished with clear acrylic on both sides for an elegant and understated appearance, the BDR Shelf is massive and extremely non-resonant, absorbing enormous amounts of vibration: a BDR Shelf is only ¾ thick, yet it is 25x less resonant than an 8 thick granite slab and has 4 times the vibration absorbing power of 2 thick MDF!"
Solid Tech Rack Of Silence ROS 1
Amp stands with cross braces suspended by springs and amps feet sitting on Sims Novcom pucks.
Solid Tech Rack Of Silence ROS 1
This is a picture of the ROS 1 Ref without the spring suspension. Currently set up with 1.6
(2) 244 on top of the record cases, (3) 242's on front wall, (1) on wall behind chair
Mint LP Mirror protractor
Fantastic tool for checking stylus alignment
Cable Isolators ESD
Made of Electro Static Dissipative Polyurethane. The jury is still out on the effect these have on the sound but they have helped separate and organize the cables.
Sims Vibration Dynamics Navcom silencers
Used between Rack Of Silence and BDR shelves under preamp and CDP. They are also under the acrylic shelves under Direct satellite box and Walker speed controller shelf.
Purchasing Department I-Mac & inter net
Without this tweak the rest would have been near impossible, at best very difficult and a lot slower.
Hickok 539 b
Roger Kennedy digital mods and calibration. A must have for matching sections, power tubes and to protect equipment.
VPI 16.5
This was a great buy it really make record cleaning a snap!!!!
Digital Tachometer no name
Reads strip of tape on the side of the platter.
PHONIC PAA2
The PAA2 can perform full acoustical analysis using its real-time spectrum analyzer. Thirty-one, one-third octave bands are displayed on the screen real-time with selectable response times (35ms, 125ms, 250ms and 1 second) and weighting options (Flat, A and C). The operator needs to select the SPL (Speaker Pressure Level) range (30-90 dBSPL, 50-110 dBSPL, 70-130 dBSPL) for the test being run. The user can select any of the center frequencies and display the level that was measured with the numbers displayed above the real-time graph. The peak level can also be displayed for reference. There are a total of sixteen memory locations for storing data. The measured spectrum data can be stored to any one of ten memory locations. Averaged data from any or all of the ten memory locations can be stored to the remaining six memory locations.
System edited: Put PAD Aqueous Anniversary PC on power supply for LAP-150 Mkll power supply. Initial reaction, improved quality of sound like rolling in NOS tubes, bigger dynamics, less congested more extended presentation of notes, highs and lows resulting in better defined instruments within a more 3D SS. Also changed speaker position, now can barely see the WATTS interior sides. Also changed the feedback in the amps. All this has resulted in a much better sound, so far!!!
System edited: Removed CD PC from EP 15A and also changed PC. This led to changing the cant in of the 8's reducing the amount of the WATT'S inside surface that is visible from listening position. Original impression is a more 3 dimensional SS with more air between instruments, better focus and more dynamics!!!
Finally got a 200 amp Square D all in one 30 space box installed with new grounding rod. Next I have to decide where to run dedicated lines, to the front room or a dedicated space 16' x 20' or 14' x 24' etc... in garage!!!
Thanks for the heads up!!! If anything I said helped, fantastic!!! Another thing you might try is flattening the drape on the front wall if it is gathered, this will give more focus and detial to the instruments and add air between them in the sound stage. I found a record the other day I thought you might appreciate:
"New Orleans' Sweet Emma And Her Preservation Hall Jazz Band" on VPH(?)
Recorded on Oct 18, 1964 at the Tyrone Guthrie Theatre in Minneapolis-St. Paul area.
The sonics are surprisingly good, it's a great record!!!
Well after much experimenting and listening, I have totally changed my listening position and speaker placement. I now have them on the short wall with a solid wall to the left and right and (for now/temporary) thick velvet drapes behind the soundstage and behind my listening position. It's already a HUGE improvement! Ghostly soundsage and a joy to listen to. One can really get lost in the music! So I wanted to thank you for the guidence and thoughts. I am in the process of experimenting with some room tunes that I made, but plan to purchase some when I decide where they will best be utilized. Thanks again and happy holidays!! I will have new pics soon.
The room treatments have improved the sound more than I imagined they would, a good return on a relatively modest investment. Are you still in the 12'X14'X20' H (3360 cu ft) room? My room's dimensions are: 14.6'X24'X10' H and including a small alcove to the back right I'd guesstamate a total of about 4000 cu ft. I think you'd want absorption behind you and at the first reflection points and if you can do it bass traps in the front corners. Personally I prefer to have walls on right and left sides of the front wall, my experience has been it's harder to work with an open space on one of the sides, so however that works is where I'd start. If you don't have a SPL meter and a test cd I'd get them and start measuring your room SPL's!!!! Stereophile has some test cd's as does Acoustic Science Corporation and Rat Shack has the SPL meter. I see a pillow below the flat screen is that because there seems to be to much treble?
Samhar, I have a room similar in size to yours and am thinking of putting my speakers on the short wall, similar to your configuration. Can you give me some thoughts and also how much of an improvement did the bass traps and room treatments help? Thanks!
System edited: Installed four RealTraps Mondo Traps at the first and second reflection points replacing GIK 242's. Moved three GIK 242 to the center of the front wall. Also added two ASC 16" Tube Traps in the front corners, two ASC 11" Tube Traps sacked in a back alcove corner, two 9" ASC Tube Traps stacked in the other alcove corner and in between these, two ASC 11" half rounds and two 9" half rounds. The effects are a tight, fast, dynamic, articulate bass with amazing timbre that because of the clarity seem much bigger. The bass transient and decay are both fast and clean. When I walked from left wall to the right wall behind my chair the bass was even, this wasn't the case before it was bigger near the walls. The mids and highs also benefited with better clarity, timbre, air........... It's late I'll add more later with some pic's!!!!!
Heykay thanks!! I hope your as happy with the move as I am!!!! I just purchased 4 Real Traps Mondo traps and this morning put one in each corner of the front wall at 45* angle and broke out the Phonic PAA2 RTA to see what's happening. I'll have to move the 8's to increase the bass a little!!! So far I've left the speakers in place and tried different combinations of GIK and Real Traps and have gone back to the GIKs at first and second reflection points and the Mondo Traps in the front wall corners. I stopped experimenting and listened for the last four hours. I'm sure the sound will improved with some movement of the 8's, I just couldn't make myself stop listening!!!! What's up with the placement in your room? Just curious why you wanted to know.
Samhar really nice system you have there. I would be interested in your thoughts on the spkr. room setup after the dealer is done dialing them in compared to how you have them setup it seems like your really on top of how you want the system to sound. I went the same direction as you upgrading from Sophia 1s to the WP 8s. I have a little different amp/preamp and front end setup. And my room is pretty close to the size of yours give or take.
Lowered turntable shelf height 8" from 33" to 25" by moving the phono stage's power supply off the rack. This greatly reduced the tweeters reflection off the turntable and CDP. Will change pics soon.
System edited: Vector 3 with VTA micrometer replaces the Vector 1. The phono cable, bearing and armtube dampening material have all been improved. The result is less congestion, better definition with more extension in the top and bottom ends and a more alive airy sound. Overall quite an improvement!!!!
The systems and rooms are so different a comparison is almost impossible. That being said I'll give you my first impressions of both. Here are the systems, you can see how difficult a comparison would be. The rack between the 8's push the mids and highs forward and a "brightness" is given to the sound from reflections off the metal components. By putting eggcrate foam in front of the components the brightness was removed but the center image was still a little more forward than without the rack.
Sasha Transparent S/C & I/C's Ref or better Ayre MX-R mono blocks Ayre KX-R pre amp Wadia 381i CDP Equipment rack on side wall
My first reaction was how coherent the Sasha's sound was, there was a big oneness to the sound, seamless top to bottom no part calling attention to itself. I found myself just listening to the "Lynn Arriale Trio Live" CD and not analyzing the sound of the piano just enjoying the performance!!! At one point I tried to focus on finding some brightness from the tweeters but I couldn't!!!! They are fuller but without any congestion very dynamic but not sharp, in fact so smooth they didn't seem quite as dynamic as the 8's. I didn't pursue the Sashas any further because they are probably too difficult a load for my amps to drive well and I wanted to hear the Sophia lll's, which I was still considering, again. Before I listened to the lll's again I listened to the MAXX 3's, a bigger sounding Sasha or more correctly the Sasha is a smaller MAXX 3!!!!!
I wanted a two enclosure speaker after hearing the Sashas and the MAXX 3's soooo....I went for the 8's!!!! At 92db sensitivity I thought my amps would be able to drive them even though they drop to 2.2 ohms @ 77Hz, it seems they can!!! The 8's seem more linear than the Sasha, more dynamic and not as "sweet" this could be amps, cables, my room, the very linear PC-1, or who knows what I'm still learning what the 8's are. The tweeter is also better than the Sophia 1 and the 7's it never seems to get harsh where the others eventually would. They respond to the slightest tweak letting you know immediately better or worse!!! I was having a difficult time dialing in the PC-1 it just never sounded right, I had been running it at 500ohms then 100ohms while waiting for the 240ohm and 360ohms loading resistors. The 8's are reveling, when it's wrong you know it, I couldn't conceal the 100ohm loading with a higher VTA it just didn't sound right and it wasn't. As soon as the 240ohm loading resistor was installed and the VTA was adjusted accordingly it was very obvious this was a far better combination and the sound just seemed more correct. The PC-1 is very sensitive to very small adjustments and the 8's will reward you for your work by letting you enjoy wonderful sound when you get things right!!!! Buuuuttt the opposite is also true they will revel what's up stream and might expose problems quicker than the Sashas!!!! I would like to hear them with "warmer" amps than mine, like I'm assuming yours are!!! I also want to hear a warmer cartridge like my Urushi Black through the 8's to hear how they convey that warmth and if my perception of their sound is changed.. They also let you hear the components and the room, and are teaching me a lot about audio by making me find the problems etc.. and rewarding me if I solve them with better sound.It's difficult to know how much the Transparent cables contribute to the "sweeter" sound of the Sasha compared to the Purist with the 8's but I suspect some!!!
If your thinking of the Sashas are you going to get another amp and run mono blocks? Or would you consider the Sophia lll an easier drive for the VAC?
Hec4 I'm still working on the set up but my original reaction was the 8's sounded so much more refined, so smooth from top to bottom with better definition, much more air between notes/instruments, much faster with bigger tighter dynamics. I think what seemed like a smoother more coherent sound of the Sophia 1 compared to the WP 7's was a big less defined bass that appeared to transition well into the mid's but was really a lack of definition that gave this impression, I think cabinet resonance may contribute to this along with ...???? I remember listening to a friends WP 7's and preferring my Sophia 1's even though I didn't think the 1's were the "better" speaker, I just enjoyed listening to the 1's more!!!! I'd never say that about the 8's and the 1's The Sophia ll is said to be very similar to the WP 8's, I haven't heard them so I have to defer to other's experience.
Cmalak Thanks Cyril, I'm a very happy camper!!!! I did consider the Sophia ll especially for the price but wanted to take the step up to the WP 8's. Check out Marc Mickelson's review above and you'll find all the reasons I picked the 8's.
Congrats Sam on the W/P 8s! Did you also consider the Sophia 2s, many of which are now being sold as folks upgrade to Sophia 3s? If yes, would be interested also in that comparison and what tipped you over to the W/P 8s. Thx
How is the coherence on the WP8 compared to the Sophia 1? One of the single most influential reasons I liked the Sophia series over the W/P is better coherence between the drivers (to my ears), especially between the bass and midrange. Perhaps I'm just not used to the added bass response of the W/P, but it always sounded "detached" as if the two 8" woofers rolled off too much before the 7" mid came into play. Interested in your thoughts...
