The Core Audio Technology system is a revelation in audio reproduction.
The entire system comes in a single box. The Kryptos Music Server portion is outfitted with four discrete Core Audio Kalos power supplies. One for each of the Motherboard, PCI Audio Card, Graphics card, blu-ray and hard drives.
The digital audio I2S signal is taken directly from the PCI card unconverted, unfiltered, and DSP free and input directly into the amplifier. No more D/A, A/D, D/A conversions. The amplifier then converts this signal into a PWM format where it is reclocked, amplified, reclocked again, and then converted to analog at the output of the amplifier.
The amplifier has four discrete power supplies of its own for each stage of the process as well as a dedicated atomic reference clock.
This system has a voltage-controlled attenuator that is outside of the signal path for a distortion and DSP free control of the volume granting the low distortion of passive preamps with the drive of an active tube stage.
The end result is a simplified system with endless possibility. No more amplifier, preamp, or DAC, and thousands of parts removed from the signal path. No more audio cables. No benefit from power cables, power conditioning, or any tweaks. The system gets plugged directly into the wall and the only cables required are speaker cables. I personally use $.50/ft zip cord because they make no difference in this setup.
The resulting sound is the highest resolution, most harmonically correct sound possible in audio reproduction. There is no tube or vinyl system that can hold a candle to the energy or texture that it produces.
The signal is then sent to the Kalon loudspeaker, which has no crossover, no phase distortion, and a cabinet-free frequency response down to 28hz.
While there is no way to truly reproduce live music in your room. This is as incredibly close as you can get.
Core Audio Technology Kryptos Blu-ray Media System
High end media server with 9 dedicated power supplies for each of atomic clock generator, motherboard, PCI card, graphics card, hard drives, i2s stage, amp stage, master clock, and digital output. Fully digital signal path all the way up to the speakers. No filters, conversion, or DSP whatsoever. Remove thousands of parts from the system -- no more DAC, preamp, or separate amplifier.
Core Audio Technology Kratos Digital
Part of the Kryptos Media system. A fully digital amplifier. 4 dedicated power supplies, one for each stage (amplifier, I2S, Master Clock, and digital stages). For a fully digital signal path all the way up to the speakers.
Core Audio Technology Kalon Loudspeaker
The Kalon is a zero baffle full-range point source sporting a glass support structure. It sounds even more elegant than it looks. Pictures soon.
Thanks for the message. I am glad I am winning at least someone over to the light side!
How amazing would it be if audiophiles started to realize audio isn't about competition, rather about community and helping each other have better sound.
All of these companies talk crap about each other rather than working together to provide an even better product for the customer. The more people that work together the more each person benefits. Group efforts are always more effective and there is great sound to be had at all price points.
Keep enjoying your music, that's what it's all about!
Sorry I missed these two comments. I've been swamped with my film work and investing business. Boy, I have to update this a bit too.
Tubes are just filters. They pass only even harmonics. It is the odd harmonics generated in most so-called "low-distortion" devices that cause the sound to lack organic character and naturalness. Because they generate those odd harmonics they can 'never' sound as natural or harmonically correct as a tube system.
The solution is to create low-distortion gear that DOES NOT generate odd harmonics. This is where the power supply comes into play. Most power supplies are total crap, using cheap parts with a bunch of regulators in order to compensate for noise. It's easy to create low noise, the problem is that different circuits are impacted by different types of noise and so a single power supply formula does not work for all applications. The design topology may work, but it is actually the parts that play the largest role in how well a power supply filters and how well it prevents odd harmonics from getting into the signal path.
Live-sounding music comes from low distortion. That is a fact. The problem is that few people have heard REAL low distortion, rather they get so stuck on specs, marketing and a hyped up version of real music that they have no real way of listening to real low distortion. So to fix this they resort to tubes to filter out ONE part of the distortion.
Most people think I have a fully-tube system. And I don't have a single tube. There are a lot of misconceptions in audio.
Bare also in mind that my benchmark for live music is live unamplified music, and not my system. It is IMPOSSIBLE to capture live music, there is no microphone out there that has the sensitivity or range to capture the intensity of a live performance. Then the recording is further distorted by conversions and plugins. So the BEST you can hope for is accurate reproduction, or you are just CAUSING distortion in the first place if you are trying to replicate a live sound from a studio recording. It's all about the approach. But the mindset makes all the difference in whether you are long-term happy or still jumping through hoops.
My goal has always been: Organic tone, time and tune, and emotional engagement. I have no interest in hype or artificial audio like so many companies create.
As for my Orpheus...
I sold that close to a year ago. It's a great unit, but I moved on to testing other technologies. I actually find now with my Kryptos 2.0 system and Kratos SE Amplifier that it doesn't really matter what DAC I use because the data being given to the DAC is so accurate that it doesn't need to work very hard. The system is so low distortion that I can use really any DAC and it'll still sound organic and incredibly engaging. Resolution may change my 1-2% from a $5 DAC to a $5000 DAC, but that's not enough for me to lose sleep over. I just modify the power supply on a cheap DAC and it will blow most $5k DACs out of the water anyway.
A fairly simple test is to see if cables still make a difference in your system. If they still make a difference then you still have too much distortion in your system to understand what I'm talking about.
Email me if you have questions, I'm always happy to help.
System edited: Made some substantial changes to the system over the past few months. Total power supply redesigns. The new DAC totally crushed the Metric Halo LIO-8, which was stellar to begin with. Even ran the LIO-8 with a Kalos power supply for a while, but the new DAC still outperformed it by a significant margin. Have a few new power supplies that I'm testing with VERY promising results. Not to mention the new Enigma power cables.
System edited: Made a few swaps and added the new Core Audio products The LIO-8 with power supply upgrades is one hell of the DAC. The beta (mid-level) power supplies are 300% better than the Alpha supplies I had been using/testing/building. The 15" alnicos are also QUITE a bit better than the 15" Cast Frame. Will be building a Multi-Bit R2R multichannel DAC in the next year to CRUSH the LIO-8. All a matter of time. New upgrades to the amps also coming soon -- new analog boards and power supply upgrades along with a higher-end magnetic filtration circuit. Overall quite happy with the way the system is turning out. Sounds fantastic! Come listen!
It's very much a work in progress, but I will be adding more pictures, videos and content as time permits. The design, photography and coding were all done by me.
I have the Faital Pro driver installed. It's crossing over at 500hz to my AN15s, which I decided not to sell because of how fantastic they sound for bass and midbass. The 18" drivers are incredible for deep bass, but weren't keeping up above 100hz.
This is by far the most live, dynamic sound I've ever heard. The FP drivers, according to my Fuzzmeasure results are 30dB lower distortion above 500hz any other driver I've seen in terms of 2nd and 3rd harmonic distortion. They're at -80dB, which is incredible since most drivers I've tested are around -40 or -50dB. They're crystal clear, pure, and effortlessly dynamic. No contest they're the best speakers I've ever heard.
It's unfortunate that I haven't had any time to listen lately. Worked 150 hours in the last two weeks since production started.
FYI: I am selling my AN15s. I have been running my AN15s in open baffle with a pair of 18" drivers handling the lows to good effect. The problem is that it's difficult to sell a cabinet without a driver. So I'm speaking with David about his prototype AN15 Alnico speaker to place in my current open baffle that I built.
I just didn't want to get stuck with a $900 cabinet and not be able to do something with it. Very nice maple cabinet though.
I'm also considering the Faital compression horn midrange to mount on top of my 18" drivers to handle 22khz-500hz or so. Nothing like the intensity of a compression horn, especially when it covers that large of a bandwidth. This driver is considered the best that usspeaker sells. It's just twice the price of the AN15s... decisions decisions.
Built an amp for the 18" drivers. Talk about great bass!
Quite happy with the system. Love the AN15s. Just need to make sure I'm not stuck with an expensive cabinet for no reason.
FYI number two: I just had $6000 stolen from me yesterday by an itunes hacker so be careful, gents. I'm getting my money back, but it's still a heart attack to get 30 emails from paypal saying you made "X" charges that you didn't make. Just a warning to be careful with your itunes accounts, my password wasn't even saved.
I'll keep you posted with what I decide to do driver wise. I'm not in that much of a rush, just enjoying some tunes for the time being.
Are you trying to convince ME that the results between our Dude tests weren't the same, or yourself? We had the same results. You choosing to keep your Dude doesn't mean we heard different things. That doesn't mean it's bad that you kept The Dude. You seem to make it out like I think the Dude was terrible, and I do not think that at all.
I've said it about 100 times already... music sounds like music. Tubes or solid state, it doesn't matter. The better that one gets the closer it gets to the other. MANY pieces of gear these days are attributed to sound "tube-like." It's all marketing.
I think the best you have heard personally is The Dude, and that's fine. But judging gear you have not heard is not accurate or fair. I have heard every piece of gear I have placed judgment on, and to be frank, you are making things up. I would encourage you not to pose judgment on the Prism until you hear one in a proper system for yourself.
As for my amplifier. I am working with Tom, but I am not using his Kits in my amplifier. I use the amp board, but replace and rearrange many of the parts on the board. The power supply is totally my own design and all of the parts in the amp itself are of my own choosing. The only thing that resembles a kit is the color of the PCB.
Of course Clayton was playing with Tube algorithms. The whole point of his spatial system is to be able to tailor your sound to your liking. The DSP system has limitless possibilities in creating an accurate sound that works for everyone. There are thousands and thousands of plugins out there for doing just that. One category is tube emulation. And people like you will latch onto that in a heartbeat because you're married to tubes and feel the need to have tubes in your system.
As I said, my system is more natural and musical than any tube system I've heard. I get very organic sound from The Prism.
I've been listening to some VERY high-end tube systems out here. My point is that there are many people that want to be able to add tube coloration to their system just for shiggles. It doesn't mean the system NEEDS it or lacks something. And even if it does, then they have that option.
I find that PV works nicely in my system. It's more natural-sounding that Amarra. It's a very noticeable difference over plain itunes in my system.
It's a compressor/limiter that adds tube coloration to the sound. I tested the tube preamp plugin made by the same company, but it barely did anything besides add distortion
This limitor works even when no threshold is applied. But it does a REALLY good job of bringing detail out of the mix and adding romance to the sound.
It's definitely a coloration, but adds more oomph and detail to the mix. It beautifies the music.
While I don't think my system needs it at all, I can say there are A LOT of people who would really like this plugin. It's "Big Blue Limiter" made by 112dB.
I haven't used the Tripoint in my own system, but I've heard it in and out of two systems now so I know what it does. Like I said, it works, but I also think you could get 99% of the performance for much less money. It's a $12k grounding system, not even a power conditioner. If I am not allowed an opinion on equipment that I have heard outside of my system it becomes very difficult to create a basis for what I can enjoy in my own system.
I personally do not find the Topaz Isolation transformers to be plastic sounding at all. But I replaced the power cords and outlets on mine even since you heard it. That being said, you listened to it for a VERY short period of time and LOVED it. It seems to me that you are remembering something negatively for the sake of remembering it negatively. I heard you say "wow" more than once during that session.
Also, the electronic crossover in that system wouldn't negate a change elsewhere. That's like saying that no matter what speakers you had in your system, if the DBX was in the chain EVERY system would sound the same and sound terrible.
What we heard when we removed the dude was not subtle. Both of us agreed that it was a more enjoyable and less fatiguing sound. You are welcome to choose to remember that differently.
I am NOT marketing a DIY spatial system. I am marketing a very nice amplifier and a Mac Mini power supply, which is being discussed with Clayton for pairing with his spatial system.
Also, I loved the nuforce with the Aerial speakers. It wasn't until I upgraded from the nuforce that I realized their flaws.
Removing The Dude from my system and from your system posed the same results. So blaming other equipment in the chain (totally different equipment I might add) is not a feasible argument in this situation. If the results were different for each of our systems then I would agree with your argument, but the results were the same. And I didn't have a room with poor acoustics or low-performance wiring.
Again, my argument isn't that The Dude sucks -- on the contrary, it's an awesome preamplifier. I am just encouraging you to keep the facts straight. Perhaps now with a non-active system where cables become variables again and there's no crappy DSP in the chain maybe your system sounds better with The Dude than without.
If you test without The Dude then I encourage you to try Pure Music. I have been using it for over a month now and it's considerably better-sounding than just plain itunes. I played with Amarra as well. I liked both for different reasons, but Amarra is more expensive of course.
I don't really think that musical and revealing are mutually exclusive entities. For instance, speakers only look at three factors: power, phase, and frequency. A speaker in and of itself cannot create any of these things. It merely is reproducing what the amplifier gives it.
Music IS musical and full of emotional content. Whether you are close miking a guitar or using a single stereo mic in a concert hall you will find emotional content.
Look at different types of speakers. In an active 2-way speaker the amplifier is contained inside the chassis. It's usually a mediocre amp. Think about it, these companies still must make money. They are selling an amp/speaker combo for the price of a modest set of speakers). That mediocre amp is prone to above-normal cabinet resonances. Vibration, in my opinion, is one of the single largest external sources of distortion in the audio system.
When that component becomes distorted it causes distortion to the frequency and phase portions of the equation. The phase distortions cause errors to the timing and tonality of the music by hiding transients and masking harmonic detail.
The reason people love full-range drivers so much is because they are perfectly time and phase coherent. It's virtually impossible to have a multi-way loudspeaker to be perfectly time and phase coherent because you have two tonally different drivers handling different parts of an instrument's frequency spectrum. That's why as you work your way up the line in multi-way speakers you find that they get more analytical, but lose emotional content and become less engaging.
I would say that a system can be ruthlessly revealing, but also quite musical. How revealing a system is has to do with neutrality and resolution. Musicality has to do with phase and speed. I happily have both resolution and musicality in my system. I had a buddy comment on a singers voice a few weeks ago about how he's heard the detail in her voice many times, but never so much of her emotion while singing. He followed my system over the years and was amazed at the difference between this setup and the setup with The Dude, which was the last system he heard of mine.
As for grounding... I've found it to be beneficial in most systems. Not life changing, but beneficial and fairly easy to do. The easiest way is just grab the wires from a chassis screw and screw it into the outlet plate screw as a simple test.
I listened to the Tripoint Audio Troy grounding system, and there's no doubt that they work -- but it doesn't require THAT kind of money to be spent to get good performance IMO.
I'm familiar with the Ground Zero unit. Thanks for the link though, I know a few people who have been looking for something like this.
The internet is full of marketing hype and has so many people believing so many bizarre things about audio. It's no wonder why the pro-audio guys laugh at audiophiles so much. I think it's extremely important to listen for yourself and make judgments for yourself. Everyone's ears have a different frequency response.
So notice that I have not made comments about any gear that I have not heard for myself. Every comparison I make for a tweak, piece of gear, speaker, etc., are all made from personal experience and my opinions are my own. And I welcome anyone who is in the area to listen to my system and tear it to shreds (so to speak). I'm not married to any of my gear. If I find tubes that sound better than what I have I have no problem swapping something out. Too many people get married to their gear.
I am not talking about ground loop noise, Andrew. Grounding helps to remove RF and EMI from the circuit (the chassis acts as a shield and that has to be drained somewhere). If the chassis isn't properly grounded that noise can be translated to an audible hiss through the tweeter. Ground loop is a different situation entirely and is when ground noise is inducted back into the circuit because components are grounded to different places in the system rather than one location (etc).
I'd imagine many people who use the prism in a recording system are also using active loudspeakers. I haven't heard great, musical active speakers in any system. I'm sure they're out there, but there is so much cabinet vibration that it's impossible to have a good amp inside a speaker cabinet. That alone can be why they didn't find the prism to be musical. There are SO many other variables even if it was external amplification and a decent set of monitors. I took some pictures of the inside of the prism... it's a work of art, and I would pose the argument that it's possible the issue with the prism wasn't the prism at all.
I think it is correct to say that many recordings have poor mixing and miking techniques. It's an art form in and of itself to mic a performance, live or otherwise.
The live music I listened to was 100% un-amplified. I listened to very little amplified music -- it tended to be too loud and hurts my ears.
I used pro-toolsHD systems, which are the industry standard mostly for film. So I certainly wasn't using a Sony Sonoma system. I did freelance work for local A'Capella, Jazz, and rock bands. I also did foley and sound mixing for quite a few indy films. I am now working on the NBC show Love Bites (ugh), doing audio for an $80 million dollar film directed by Javier Gutierrez, and potentially an abc family show. I did work with one engineer who actually converted a 10" speaker into a microphone. Was one of the biggest-sounding and most accurate recordings I ever worked on. I'll have to see if I can find it... it may be a 100mb+ file though.
Let me correct something. My personal system isn't to recreate a live event. I am well aware that the harder one tries to do that the more they realize they are just causing distortions (though sometimes attractive) in their audio system. The goal with my system is accuracy.
I have heard many people talk about bad recordings being bright or edgy. Brightness is a distortion to the frequency response and the glare is usually around 2khz -- interestingly enough, Andrew, that's right where you were having issues with your EP crossover, which expounded the issues. My system, even with recordings people say are terrible, never sounds bright or edgy. They do, however, lack detail and tend to sound overly compressed.
Andrew, to be perfectly fair... we removed the Dude from your system with my Topaz and we both agreed that it sounded considerably more like live music without tubes in your system. But I won't argue with you about your love for tubes... if there was no real reason to love tubes no one would.
As for vinyl, no I did not hear the vinyl rigs in my system. But I DID do A/B comparisons in the systems I heard those vinyl rigs in. I am not saying vinyl was terrible and unlistenable. I'm saying that it has distortions and limitations of its own. I found that even a modest pioneer Elite CDP, for instance, sounded considerably more natural than the high-end DiVinci turntable.
These days I listen to mostly 24/96 or 24/192 recordings.
As for cost... you are totally right. The $300 Sony CDP-705ESD is a great CD Player and is built like a tank, with a few mods it'll compete with $10k CDPs easily. I've heard systems cabled with zip cord and extremely modest gear that makes me question why I even got into this hobby. I'm constantly telling people to go listen to their car speakers so they understand the scale of difference between a low-end system and a high-end system... it's surprisingly small given the cost differences. I spent a good amount of time with $25 bookshelf speakers while I was waiting for the AN15s and I was amazed with the quality I was getting out of those speakers.
I'm not out to tell people their systems suck. I have a very different system from what most people have, however. I have also heard A LOT of systems and a lot of gear. And I know there are quite a few audiophiles who are stuck chasing their tail. I spent quite a while chasing my tail myself. I used tubes and have had modest vinyl in my system. I've jumped through those hoops. And now I have a rather "new-wave" system that finally works for me and, in my opinion, creates a path for many people who are ready to get off the tilt-a-whirl when nothing else worked.
The amplifier I use is a Class D amplifier designed around the Jensen 4-pole linear power supply. This power supply is the same supply used in the $650,000 Pivetta Opera One amplifier. It is so fast that changing power cords on my amp makes virtually zero audible difference.
As for your audible noise when close to your speakers agear. That was a grounding issue with your amplifier. High sensitivity speakers tend to have gain matching issues with high gain amplifiers. Especially at 100dB sensitivity they will have a hiss if the amplifier is not grounded properly. I know this from first hand experience with the EPs that grounding even the crappy class D amp you used easily removed the hiss. I use a complex grounding layout in the Class D amps using Goertz ribbon, even with high gain there's no noise from the speaker.
You were also listening to the Apogee Duet. Which although nice, is only a $500 piece of gear and can't be expected to replace gear costing thousands of dollars (your Z, or The Dude, it's just not likely). You also have a terrible switching power supply attached to your mac mini, which is a huge bottleneck.
You guys still don't understand what I mean about noise. The problem is that you think that noise is audible. Audible noise is distortion and is something totally different. Noise Floor is audible noise that can only be heard when your volume is up above 100dB. THAT is not the noise I am talking about. It's easy for a tube system to have a black background and depth, but that's not low noise. The noise I'm talking about is noise you don't know is there until it's gone. It's the veil that so many audiophiles speak about that hides the resolution of the music. That resolution comes from a properly designed power supply and good parts. VERY few companies use good parts.
Even TRL uses relatively inexpensive parts. I demoed my amp for a Gentleman out here who has the GT-200 monoblock amps. He is planning to buy a set of amps from me.
I think you underestimate the amount of gear that I have heard. I don't just base my theory off of hearing one or two systems. I've had hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of gear move through my system over the years. I have heard just about everything on the market in various systems. I worked in recording for 4 years and now in the film industry. I also listened to live music twice a week for YEARS.
But I am correct about vinyl. I've heard the Walker turntable ($20k), DiVinci Turntable ($50k), Clear Audio Statement Turntable ($150k), and yes, even your Galibrier, plus a few lower end tables. I am yet to hear a turntable that doesn't color the sound and exaggerate dynamics. Most of what people like about vinyl and tubes are attractive distortions.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I imagine neither of you listen to live music on a regular or occasional basis. So we are after two totally different goals. I am after a real reference of live music, and most people are after what they think live music sounds like.
That's what puts audiophiles in two different camps. Music lovers or Audiophiles. Music lovers listen to the time, tune and tone of the music. Terms like dynamics, slam, liquidity aren't even in their vocabulary. Most audiophile systems sound like HiFi.
I am saying that ONE of the causes of hiss in a tube system can be attributed to the electrons smacking against the sides of tubes.
Tubes will always be noisy, and I am yet to see a tube circuit that can boast a S/N ratio greater than 110dB. I am not saying they aren't enjoyable for music, nor have I ever said that. What I said was that tubes don't have the potential of solid state.
The goal in home audio is to create the illusion of live music. Most people have NO benchmark for what live music sounds like.
People like tubes and consider them "musical" because they are fast. Their speed allows them to have less time/phase distortion compared to solid state. The lack of phase distortion is what lends to a more musical and harmonically rich presentation with better articulation.
HOWEVER. Solid state has the potential to be just as fast if not faster. The problem is that most solid state gear has a crappy power supply. The power supply is too slow to react to the changes in signal. Because of this many people consider SS to be dry and lack emotional content.
Speed = detail. Lowering the noise floor = more speed. And to lower the noise floor a better power supply and better parts are required. The higher quality the filtration the lower the ripple in the supply. What that translates to is the supply's ability to articulate microdynamics. That extra speed is what allows you to hear the liquidity of a voice or tonality of the strings on a guitar.
I disagree that the voice is a result of distortion. The voice is a result of vibration. Because everyone's vocal cords work at different wavelengths we produce different frequencies when we talk. Some of those frequencies can be considered fatiguing when you don't like someone's voice. But even the room you are in or how close you are to the wall plays a part in what your voice sounds like.
What people don't seem to understand is that MUSIC IS MUSIC IS MUSIC IS MUSIC. It doesn't matter what you are using to play it back if your system is accurate. The problem I have face with even the highest end $300k tube systems is that they're artificial and lack REAL detail. Vinyl too is the same way. It's often artificially musical because dynamics are exaggerated when the needle jumps from right to left.
My point is that you can argue why something is better than something else until you're blue in the face. But when you do so you should understand what is making that component sound the way it does. You judge solid state the way you do because you are unfamiliar with what is preventing solid state from doing what tubes are doing and you haven't heard truly well-designed solid state gear.
I have heard a million times that this SS Amp is very "tube-like" or a DAC is very "Analog". That's because there's no such thing as tube-like or analog sound. Music sounds like music.
It's simple physics. There is virtually no way to prevent the electrons from bouncing off the glass tubes. It's been proven and is 100% measurable.
That doesn't negate that people like tubes. It merely poses why tubes are noisy no matter what you do. I think most people don't understand what noise does to musicality, tonality, and resolution until it's gone. People love the Dude Preamp, but that doesn't mean it isn't colored and doesn't veil the sound. We noticed just that when we put the Topaz in your system and removed the Dude.
At any rate, if someone enjoys their sound and they have tubes in their system then power to them. I know that most people who have tubes are searching around looking for upgrades because they feel like something is missing.
I've been going crazy battling a resonance-related issue in my system over the past few weeks. Turns out the Herbie's footers under my amp weren't working ideally. I had some brass footers lying around and placed those under the prism and amp. What a difference! I was getting ready to pull my hair out.
Another cool tidbit of information:
One of the biggest noise issues with tubes that you can't get away from NO MATTER WHAT has to do with the electrons SMACKING up against the plate.
Yes, the electrons fly through a vacuum and HIT the plate on the other side...this noise is QUITE measurable and audible.
No matter what you do with the PS or anti-vibration and all that you can NEVER get rid of this SUBTLE background "hiss"...this is why you will NEVER see tube gear with noise much lower than 100db...it is physically impossible.
Everything is really breaking in nicely. I couldn't be more thrilled with the sound.
The system is so high resolution that you can hear their clothing rustling when they're standing by the microphone. You can tell what direction they are facing on the stage. Tonality is beautiful with exceptional energy and realism. Music you FEEL inside and out. Stunning system to listen to.
A few adjustments to make to the system still, but otherwise I won't be changing anything for a while.
My next project is to rebuild my Playstation 3 power supply to make it a better bluray player. I opened it last night to see what I was up against. Plenty of stuff to at least swap out with better parts. We'll see what happens from there...
System edited: Added a temporary picture of the system. I'll replace the phone picture once my camera decides to recharge. Obviously haven't hung room treatments or anything yet.
Let me clarify what I mean by noise. I think you guys are getting signal to noise ratio confused with the noise I am referring to. SNR above 100dB is WAY more than what is necessary, since most people don't play above 100dB anyways.
What do I mean then?
Picture a sine wave. Now draw a bunch of polka dots around it. Obviously those polka dots aren't audible to us. The issue is that our components can see these polka dots. What happens is these polka dots merge with the soundwave and cause ripples and spikes.
What happens is those spikes cause frequency anomalies. The frequency anomalies act much like a standing wave in an untreated room. They cause phase cancellations and mask the resolution of the music.
I am not necessarily speaking about RF-based noise. Noise can be caused by ripple in a power supply for instance. A good power supply will have low ripple and be able to handle a large amount of voltage swing. THAT is why people like tubes. Compared to a good SS amp which can have 100Vpp, a good tube amp can have anywhere between 250-350v.
That means that you can get more gain from a single tube stage. So what you get is more 'swing' from tubes. Granted, to get a tube amp to play anywhere near the level of detail of a SS amp it would cost 3x as much and be 5x the size. Just look at Paul's amps.
Tubes are noisy. They have far more wiring to pick up noise, often crappy power supplies, and poor grounding.
Now let's step back to the idea of noise. Articulation comes from space between notes. Take a square wave as an example. With Jitter that square wave has edges that become rounded. It becomes difficult for the receiving component to understand whether the signal is on or off. This causes timing issues. That timing issue causes frequency anomalies. Those anomalies mask details and dynamics. They create a veil over the music. It is this veil that I consider noise.
I use noise and distortion as one and the same, perhaps mistakenly. Though they are both a means to the same destination. One causes the other.
Good power supplies and parts will do a better job at filtering out noise. They will also be capable of better voltage swing.
The best tubes sound like solid state. The best solid state sounds like tubes. If you have truly accurate gear then it doesn't matter what format you use. It all should sound the same.
I have nothing against Paul. As I mentioned, The Dude is a phenomenal piece of gear.
The tricky thing about noise is you don't know it's there until it's gone.
The Dude WAS neutral. The Dude was WONDERFUL. Every component I've had was the best thing since sliced bread when I had it. Because I do my homework before jumping over to a piece of gear.
That doesn't mean there is nothing better out there.
What I can say is that I owned the Dude and have heard it now in four different systems. Not one of those systems sounded bad. I have UPGRADED from that sound and am not looking back. There is nothing about the sound with The Dude that I miss.
At the same time, my benchmark for what sound I like has always been live music. I listened to live music twice a week for years. I was able to listen to live music, listen to the music in the recording studio, and further compare that recording on my own personal system.
The Dude was a really great sound, but it didn't bring me to what I heard to be real.
My system now has FAR better tonality, body, and instantaneous dynamics than the Dude ever had. The imaging is far more pristine, the soundstage deeper, wider and more stable, and the sound itself is exceptionally detailed. To make things better, it is totally non-fatiguing and I haven't even used my DSP to correct the response yet. I found the Dude to be fatiguing on my system and on Andrew's system at one time or another. I even upgraded the tubes in The Dude to great affect, but my sound got better when I took the Dude out of the system.
I never said the Dude was a bad piece of gear. I just said that it was colored and noisy compared to what I am running now.
The system I am running now I am happy with. I have no interest in upgrading anything, nor do I feel the need. So I had no intention of being hypocritical when I wrote The Dude's review. I had NO idea I would be changing my system so dramatically. But I took a blind leap and ended up with a stellar system that I can live with for a good long time.
The Dude uses a tube regulated PSU. Tube regulation is noisy. Most of the tube gear I've heard sounds pretty good. But it never is the best sound I've heard.
People like tubes for their speed. And not just musical speed, but ability to process the music. Their speed is what allows them to have better harmonic integrity and linearity, which is why many tube pieces have better tonality than solid state pieces. However, if you lower the distortion from a piece of solid state gear that is using proper parts (better parts are substantially faster) then you have all of the tonality you would ever get from a tube amp/preamp. Most tube products just color the sound.
The Dude compared to the prism is very colored. It's a nice color certainly, but compared to the Prism I didn't care for the color.
As for the Prism vs other Pro gear. For recording, the industry standard is actually Pro Tools HD. Audibly there are certainly better pieces of gear.
Just because Paul has heard those high-end pieces of gear doesn't mean his Dude preamp competes in the same league as those pieces of gear.
At the same time, Paul is trying to get you to hold onto his Dude. Of course he will say all of the other products you were looking at weren't as good.
The EPs were quite fatiguing and ultimately not very realistic. There are better, more enjoyable speakers out there. The Duet is probably a decent piece of gear, but it's not fair to compare a $500 piece of gear to a $5000 piece of gear no matter how good someone says it is.
After hearing the TC, the Prism is a totally different animal even from that. I wasn't getting ANYWHERE near optimal performance out of the Prism when using the EPs. Even before the AN15s showed up and I was using a $25 set of plastic bookshelf speakers and headphones, the system sounded considerably better than it did with the EPs.
I am not finding the prism to be even the slightest bit fatiguing. It's extremely clear and very sweet sounding, with excellent slam and dynamic capability. It's just in a totally different league from what I had with The Dude. The Dude was fantastic when I had it, but this is another way. We both found the Dude to be fatiguing at one point or another.
Granted, I am now running a new amplifier that I built. The power supply ALONE in my new amp costs me about $1000 to build. My amplifier beat a $15k Class A tube amplifier and a $10k hybrid tube/ss Amp without contest according to the individuals who bought it.
I have no need for Tube Emulators in my system. Tonality is as close to real as I've ever heard it. Is there better? There's always better. But the only system I have heard that can keep up is a six figure Magico system. Not only that, there are A LOT of things my system does better.
We can discuss tubes vs SS until we are blue in the face. Music is just music. It doesn't matter what is processing it. Tubes and solid state sound more and more alike the better those products get. The question is... who wins? The guy with tubes who is still looking for better sound? Or the guy with SS who has found that sound and doesn't feel a need to upgrade anything. Or the other way around, the guy with SS who is still looking vs the guy with tubes who has it all.
Noise floor isn't everything. Distortion is a broad word and I use it broadly.
Upgraded my Mac Mini power supply. A whole new level. Soundstage depth is tremendous and detail is out of this world, with absolutely zero fatigue.
Should have my system up and running (finally finished) in the next few days.
I replaced the power cords on my isolation transformers with Mojo Audio 8awg cross helix and built the 8awgX into the rest of the system. I plan to test the power filters used in the Shunyata Hydra V-ray in my transformers in the coming days as well.
Amplifier is breaking in nicely. WOW does it sound good. The jensen 4-pole caps in the power supply are real winners. Then again they're the same caps used in the Tripoint Audio Spartan $35k power conditioner. They're extremely dynamic and detailed, but totally smooth. Very easeful sound -- sounds like music.
The Mac Mini PSU was an incredible upgrade. After listening to the megabuck Magico system last week I found that my $12kish system gets me 99% of the way there in terms of detail and does quite a few things better (coherency and top to bottom tonal balance).
Just because I sold The Dude doesn't make it a bad piece of gear. On the contrary, it's still one of the best preamps in the world.
But when I went to this computer-based system with the Orpheus, which replaced my DAC and preamp, I got such a huge leap in performance that the Dude was obsolete.
The dude is very colored and romantic-sounding. It's a wonderful piece of gear, but it's noisy. I had it paired with Nuforce amps which are also noisy. So now that I've gotten rid of the noisy tubes and upgraded to a MUCH nicer amplifier I just hear a lot more of the music an a lot less of the distorted colorations.
It's just a different way of doing things. For me, it's more real sounding and ultimately more enjoyable because I'm not distracted by colorations or noise.
The one thing the Dude did really well was cast a deep sound stage, since my system isn't 100% up and running yet since i've moved I haven't been able to compare that with my new setup. The soundstage with the Orpheus is FAR more precise and wider, but we shall see what happens in terms of depth... I'll post a followup in the next few weeks along with pictures.
I plan to post pics as soon as I finish settling in at my new place. It's a bit of chaos at the moment. Probably in a couple of weeks!
My new listening room is FANTASTIC. It's larger than my room in NC. It's trapezoidal in shape with 10' ceilings. Probably 10x15x30 if I had to estimate. I'll measure it at some point. I totally lucked out on these new digs -- needed to get out of the crappy area I was in.
I am enjoying the fiddling. I really don't feel the need to upgrade anything -- not that I hear anything that really needs upgrading.
My plan in the near future is to run over to Weinhardt designs and listen to his Magico system for comparison's sake.
You are right, SNR is only one component to good sound.
I am one of the privileged few who has the opportunity to listen to live music multiple times a week. I also worked in recording. So I was in a unique position to be able to compare the real thing, to the recorded thing, to the thing on my system. So my reference has always been REAL music, not what I think music sounds like.
There are a lot of variables in sound. However, when I say remove the noise and remove the distortion that goes for a few things.
Removing noise is a simple concept. It means lowering the noise floor so that it isn't masking out any aspects of the music. Distortion on the other hand is something totally different. Distortion actually corrupts the waveform and alters time and phase coherency.
Music has three domains. Time/Phase, Frequency/Amplitude, and power (the rate at which energy flows).
Fixing distortion serves two purposes. One, it flattens the frequency response so that the audio spectrum is as intended. Distortion also corrupts the time and phase of the music. That has to do with imaging and transients, and harmonic alignment etc.
People like tubes because they are very fast. This serves two purposes. The first being that because of their speed they are much more coherent and accurate to time and phase. That is why people say tubes have more accurate tonal accuracy and cast a wider/deeper soundstage.
People like solid state because it is lower noise. The lower noise serves to make the sound more detailed and grants a more linear frequency response.
HOWEVER...
As each of these pieces of gear gets better and distorts the sound less and less, they sound more and more alike. I imagine you've heard that an amp sounds very "tube-like". There's no such thing.
Music is music is music. It doesn't matter what components you are using to get there. Accuracy is accuracy.
What my system does correctly is a few things. One, it has extremely low noise. This low noise allows the system to be extremely detailed and have a flat frequency response. My room itself (arguably the largest source of distortion in most systems), is corrected with an EQ to flatten the In-room response along with acoustic treatments.
The second thing is that it's low distortion. The prism receives bit-perfect audio signals with nearly zero latency. The Prism itself has arguably the best DAC and Clock available on the market next to the ULN-8. That means it has extremely low jitter. That translates to no timing errors or distortion in the phase domain.
The signal is nearly perfect when it leaves the prism. We have low noise, time and phase coherent, and flat 20-20 response before it gets to my amp.
The amp is a Class D design with a Linear power supply to remove the problems with switching noise. The power supply is a large Jensen 4-pole supply with IXYs rectifier. The Jensen caps are considered the best PSU caps on the market... at a price ($90 each). The board itself uses SMDs for lower distortion, shorter signal path, lower impedance, and less distortion from mechanical vibration. The board itself is a 4-layer PCB also for lower resistance and mechanical dampening. I use pure copper binding posts and bare wire for a copper to copper connection for no impedance mismatches from cabling. I also use one of the best balanced input circuits on the market. It was all designed with performance in mind.
No for the speakers. The speakers are a true point source full-range speaker. The larger driver is flat 22hz-15khz. Given that there is zero information above 10khz on redbook CDs that wasn't a problem. With my EQ software I am able to flatten the response 20-20khz. Being a point source there is no crossover and the speaker cables are direct hardwired to the drivers. Losing the crossover removes a huge source of distortion and phase errors. Music itself is a point source and 360 degrees in phase, this is as close to that as I can get. The large driver's dispersion is also corrected in my software. Since the latency is so low, it does no distortion to the audio signal itself. (Believe me, I've done extensive AB comparisons -- gotta love the bypass feature!)
So my signal arriving at the speakers is extremely low distortion and low noise. The speakers are a perfect point source and are perfectly time and phase coherent. Their tonality is exactly the same from top to bottom.
Needless to say, it's the closest to live music I have heard for under $300k -- and does many things better than the $300k systems I have worked on.
One of the things I pride myself in is that when I give someone a suggestion for their system it always makes a positive difference. Not only does it make a positive difference, but it makes the same EXACT difference in every single system. That's how it should be.
Musical tastes may change from person to person, but when music is accurately portrayed it's no longer an equipment or sound preference -- it's a musical preference.
Musical reproduction is actually fairly simple. It's audiophiles and marketing companies that complicate it. They make us think it's harder to get than it really is and so we need this tweak or that to get there. Not true.
Ok... I'm stepping off the soap box. Thanks for your comments!
Yes, I replaced the noisey stock Raytheons and tried both the 5692 RCA "Red Base" tubes as well as an NOS Russian 6SN7, both of which were huge upgrades over the stock raytheon tubes in terms of lowering the distortion. Marconi 6SN7s are also pretty good and I tried those. I preferred the NOS Russian tubes.
Bare in mind I'm not talking an audible noise like a hiss or a hum. I am talking about the noise floor. I lowered the noise of The Dude considerably, but it is substantially noisier and became ultimately less musical than the system I have now.
Not saying the Dude is bad... it's probably one of THE BEST preamps on the market. It's just not as good as what I'm using now.
The front end I am using is a Pro-DAC and preamp. So I have a bit-perfect signal being sent to my amp. I can set up a similar system for around $6k. (roughly the price of the Dude + a decent DAC)... which is basically what I did. Sold my DAC and The Dude and was able to set up this system for myself. There are lower-end options (around $2500) that also trounce the Dude. It's not even a contest.
I've been telling people for ages that if you remove the noise the music will be there. Tubes or Solid state, it doesn't matter. Remove the noise and more music will be present.
The Dude preamp has been replaced first by the TC Studio Konnect 48 and now by the prism sound orpheus.
The Dude was noisy and the higher-performance my system became the more I realized how the dude was holding my system back. Tube rectifiers are not accurate and are very noisy to begin with. And ultimately music comes from removing the noise. The information is there, it's just hidden behind distortion and noise.
System edited: Lowering the noise floor is what matters. Music contains a lot of information. Some of that is extraneous. Keeping that information aligned properly is of utmost important. Think of it this way. Glare and brightness are not because your system is overly revealing. It is caused by distortion in some component. Distortion is just one form of noise. Another form is timing noise. Ever wonder why gear that sounds hyper revealing, but uber boring and flat? NOISE. You remove the noise and music will come out. Harmonics line up properly for proper tonality, transients are sharp, but not edgy. So when noise is removed you have proper depth and realism. I've been listening to live music twice a week for months now. I judge my system in two ways. 1. I listen to live music. 2. I have been doing sound design and working with a composer for my film using PRO AUDIO. Comparing live music to pro-audio I am able to maintain better accuracy both to what I can get through ANY system, and what music really sounds like. You don't need to spend a million bucks to hear live music in your room. I'll post shortly about why cables make a difference in one system and not in another...
